My car audio install

Hi Walt have you got any pictures.

Hi RichG.. There are pictures all the way through this post.. You should be able to see them..

Sorry I meant more pictures

Wow, this is fantastic, great vision and persistence - amazing to see something like this in a cabby.

Thanks Oldschoolcool.. I have seen plenty of installs in mk1's at the shows, usually all for extreme visual effect (back seats removed, couple of 12" subs and power caps etc) and where there is a place for that in the show arena, I wanted mine to be perfect in sound first and looks a very close second. I have always loved my Rivage. I loved it as a totally standard car for that very reason. But I have to say that if I could have had my wish, thinking back to those days when I would stand outside the showroom looking at a Rivage slowly rotating on an angled platform under the bright lights.. I would have had one with leather.. So to add leather, I had to go one better than standard to make it worthwhile doing it.. The leather became more and more a part of the plan as the stereo evolved. The good thing is though, that I have all the original stuff stored away for the future just in case. I doubt I will ever go back to stock now. But for my OCD and peace of mind, its all still there safe and sound..  

Ok RichG.. I took a couple more pics today. First of all the AGM battery. It is slightly larger than the battery stated for the car. Basically, the dimensions are the same with the exception of being a few cm longer (I think about 4cm if I remember rightly), the difference being much more power and the ability to deep cycle and produce high cranking amps. these batteries state 760cca (cold cranking amps) but when new test at over 1000cca. Also the 70ah capacity is greater than the standard sized battery, however being Absorbed Glass Mat, it is dry internally and as such can deep cycle without allowing sulphate crystals to form on the lead degrading performance. So although it is only say 10% larger capacity, the usable capacity is massively more.



Secondly I wanted to show how the door pods fit in relation to the dash. In order to keep that stock look, the lower door pods needed to be made to be as close a fit to the dash as possible. So the angle and size of the bevel had to be exact taking into account the addition of leather not only to the door card, but also to the pod itself front and back. To help anchor the rear of the door card at the door pod, I used the standard door poppers but also Pond liner repair tape which is like a black, super sticky butyl rubbery putty stuff. The same stuff as was used originally at this point on the door card by VW. But for those of you looking for this gunky black stuff, its pond liner repair tape. (Not really tape as the name suggests, its like a super sticky strong putty) Without the black pond liner tape putty stuff, the door cards may pop off at this point due to the weight of the speaker and pod. It also reduces vibrations at that point.

Just something that dawned on me.. During this build I machined quite a lot of MDF board.. MDF is very easy to use and is basically a mixture of hard and soft wood fibres bonded together with a formaldehyde based adhesive. However, if anyone is going to take inspiration from this and go and make some stuff out of MDF, please bare in mind that it is this formaldehyde which is the dangerous component of MDF. It is safe until the board is machined and the dust particles get into your lungs, because those wooden micro fibres contain the carcinogenic formaldehyde. So please understand that it is very important to machine MDF outside and always wear a mask.. Most people know its dangerous, but I think people get complacent because of ignorance.. So now you know exactly why and can make the right decision if you use it.. Thanks..

Quick update for anyone interested.. I decided to upgrade the sound processor (sorry Joe90k) to a Japanese pioneer ODR P-90x.. While I was at it, I decided to re wire and re install the boot build to show the processor off through a small window I made from Polycarbonate. So I had to make a new support for the false floor and do a nicer job of the cables.. So here's a few pics to show how it looks now..

Very tasty work as always.

Proper OCD on those cables, I love it walt  

Very classy install indeed    

Looks excellent walt, don't apologise to me for spending money on your car!

I don't want you to see my previous post as overly critical nor was I trying to put you down for the selection of components and your install. You clearly know your stuff and have chosen some really highly regarded components not to mention your attention to detail. You are the first person I have seen on this site to go above and beyond when putting audio gear into a Mk1. As I said, you clearly know your stuff and I feel that I have a reasonable knowledge of car audio purely from having worked in the industry for a few years, however I don't see myself as an expert, far from it.

No one can explain how something sounds, there are lots of people who will not appreciate the quality of sound and as I was trying to explain before you can get a really good quality of sound from speakers that don't cost the earth that are in a decent enclosure. As a direct comparison, I have heard a mutant twin 10" £16 bandpass enclosure far outplay a 12" JL Audio 10" W7 driver in a tuned ported box playing from the same JL Audio amplifier. The quality of the sound from the mutant was far better because the enclosure was acoustically better designed and as a result the overall musicality was better.

To me, the fact that the stock Mk1 door cards are made from hardboard and that the speakers aren't fixed to the metal door structure in any way means the speaker enclosure is not optimum. The door card will flex and the speaker will not play to its full potential. For this reason I remade my door cards from 8mm ply with 15mm MDF speaker rings all screwed to the metal structure of the door card itself to prevent this. You mention the black sticky putty stuff above (I know this as Dum Dum) which you have used to stabilised your main drivers, this is exactly what I mean, you have had to use a less than ideal solution to keep the speaker sealed (Albeit probably the best solution for the Mk1 stock location). I chose to use 5.25" speakers because I could fit them into the door cards in a slightly different location to stock which I found to be more stable. In simple terms what I was getting at was that if you want the best possible sound (Which clearly you do) then the Mk1 is a very poor base on which to start. If quality of sound is your main goal then there are other VW's which have acoustically better designed doors and chassis' (The Mk4 comes to mind) which will take full advantage of the component quality you have.

All of that being said, clearly I am also in love with my Mk1 as much as you and as such I can fully understand why you would want to spend the money on it. I'm just personally not sure I would spend so much time, effort and money on an audio install to try to get a better and better quality of sound from it when the car has its limitations and as such I can't see the money being worth it. Please don't take offence from that, I'm just voicing my opinion. It's your car and your money and obviously you can do whatever you wish!

I'm sure if I bump into you at any point that after listening to your car it will sound excellent, but it could sound even better. That's all I was trying to say.

Do you own any other cars with installs? I would be really interested to see photos if you do!

P.S. It was very poor of me to not have replied previously and for that I apologise! I don't get as much time to get on here now, I have only just had time to read through all your posts since my last post on this thread.

Hey no worries Joe90k. I never thought for one minute you were being malicious. You make some fair points. However, my car is a show car and as a perfectionist, I struggle with any thoughts of my car not being the absolute best it can be. I have shown my car at 6 shows and won something at 5 of them. So making a change to a car of that standard has to be justified by being of such a high quality that nobody can mark you down for it as a result of what you have done. I have seen silly extreme installs at the vw shows, you know, the SPL based cars. Its all very impressive but a lot easier to do than an SQ car.

Having worked in the business yourself, I am sure you are aware of some of the equipment used in setting up an active set up in a car. RTA (real time alignment) equipment etc.. For most people, this would do the trick for setting the sound levels and even as a tool to set the time alignment in the right hands. But I am fortunate to have a friend with the most accurate sound measuring equipment available, who is going to help me set up the system. He helped me last year with the previous processor and my God.. It was phenomenal. So hopefully if we can achieve even better results with this new ODR P-90x processor, then I think the car will be at SQ competition standard.

It will never win any awards for bass, you are quite right and mentioned that in your first post, however, there is still plenty there.. I think the strengths of my system are that the angle of the drivers and cabriolet roof mean the reflections are nil. Combine that with perfectly set time alignment (emphasis on the perfectly) and the quality of components and purity of signal and it really is into competition level stuff..

Hopefully I can get to meet you at one of the shows this year. My aim was to set the bar high, and by that, I mean fit the best car audio in a Mk1 golf cab ever.. Whether or not I have managed that is open to debate, but I am quietly confident that you will be impressed regardless of whether I could have got close to that quality for less money. Because that was never really a factor in the build.

I think when people build a show car, either restoring or as in my case, upgrading, they must have that desire of perfection and nothing less. There are a lot of good cars in the car show world. To win anything, it has to be in a different league. I do compete to try and win. But rather than wanting to beat other people, I want to win for myself. As a personal challenge, you know.. I look at other cars as a bench mark as to how good my car has to be and these are factors that influence my install and interior. I may win some, I may lose some. But I want my car to be the one that everyone would love to own.

Totally agree with you about SPL vs SQ. For me SPL is for boy racers with big wallets, there is no finesse to it. My audio install will never win any awards for SQ because I hadn't set out to do so, just to get a decent quality sound from the car. The engine in my car tends overpower the audio, so for me spending lots on trying to get the car to an SQ level would have meant a hell of a lot of acoustic barrier and therefore weight. I was aiming to make a very rounded OEM+ Mk1 which I feel I have done. (I'm getting there at least!)

If you are talking about entering the car into an SQ competition then really my previous argument is null and void because you do want the very best you can afford fitted to the car to make the sound as close to perfect as possible. Especially if you are also utilising RTA.

I am also totally on the same level as you when you speak of putting your own car in a different league etc. It's something I think as a car enthusiast we all strive for. Keep up the good work walt and as I said I hope I bump into you at some point soon!

Cheers Joe.. I'll keep you posted of any shows I'm going to this year..

Quick update for anyone interested. Following all the upgrades shown previously, I (with the help of my friend and his sound monitoring equipment) set about setting up all the fully active adjustments.. Volume of each individual speaker, the cut off frequencies and slopes with the crossovers and most importantly, the timing. The soundstage and depth of field are playing well outside the car. What I mean by that is that if you close your eyes, you have no idea that you are in the confines of a car and would believe yourself to be in a much bigger room.. This in itself really impressed me but with just one issue niggling me. The 6" speakers in the doors just cant play at a low enough frequency. This is down to in effect that the speaker cabinet comprising of the pod, door card and door itself, being unable to allow the driver to play any lower rather than the driver itself not being capable.

I personally loved the aesthetic of the 6" driver and pod and tried to improve the cabinet as best I could, given that it is a car door at the end of the day and have finally resigned myself to the fact that in order to play lower in the doors, I am going to need bigger bass drivers in the doors. There is no getting round it. It has to be done.

I am sure that some of you reading this will be wondering, "surely the sub woofer will compensate for the lack of bass from the front bass drivers?".. Well yes it does. However, the higher the frequency you cross over a sub, the more directional it is. So at the 80hz crossover point I have it at now, it is noticeable that the sub is in the boot. The lower I can get that crossover frequency, the less noticeable its location. Ideally I need to get the doors playing down to 50hz.

So… I have purchased a pair of the best 8" car audio speakers that money can buy. For the car audio geeks out there, they are the Seas Lotus 8" drivers. To house these beasts, I have had to make new speaker pods. They took me a few days to make because of the complex design. But they are finished and with the trimmers now having the same black vinyl finish of the earlier pods. It is costing me £200 to trim the pods up and this was priced as a favour because I have had so much work done by them in the past. Here are a few pics of the new pods I made. I will put more up when I get them back from Autotrim in Denton.

Wow epic !

Keep up the good work

wow, forget trimming them and apply some clear varnish, beautiful workmanship

I admire your tenacity and attention to detail. I Like my sounds but would not have the skills, knowledge or patience for this level but well done; would be amazing to hear something like this in a mk1.

walt said

Quick update for anyone interested. Following all the upgrades shown previously, I (with the help of my friend and his sound monitoring equipment) set about setting up all the fully active adjustments.. Volume of each individual speaker, the cut off frequencies and slopes with the crossovers and most importantly, the timing. The soundstage and depth of field are playing well outside the car. What I mean by that is that if you close your eyes, you have no idea that you are in the confines of a car and would believe yourself to be in a much bigger room.. This in itself really impressed me but with just one issue niggling me. The 6" speakers in the doors just cant play at a low enough frequency. This is down to in effect that the speaker cabinet comprising of the pod, door card and door itself, being unable to allow the driver to play any lower rather than the driver itself not being capable.

I personally loved the aesthetic of the 6" driver and pod and tried to improve the cabinet as best I could, given that it is a car door at the end of the day and have finally resigned myself to the fact that in order to play lower in the doors, I am going to need bigger bass drivers in the doors. There is no getting round it. It has to be done.

I am sure that some of you reading this will be wondering, "surely the sub woofer will compensate for the lack of bass from the front bass drivers?".. Well yes it does. However, the higher the frequency you cross over a sub, the more directional it is. So at the 80hz crossover point I have it at now, it is noticeable that the sub is in the boot. The lower I can get that crossover frequency, the less noticeable its location. Ideally I need to get the doors playing down to 50hz.

So… I have purchased a pair of the best 8" car audio speakers that money can buy. For the car audio geeks out there, they are the Seas Lotus 8" drivers. To house these beasts, I have had to make new speaker pods. They took me a few days to make because of the complex design. But they are finished and with the trimmers now having the same black vinyl finish of the earlier pods. It is costing me £200 to trim the pods up and this was priced as a favour because I have had so much work done by them in the past. Here are a few pics of the new pods I made. I will put more up when I get them back from Autotrim in Denton.

Hi Walt amazing workmanship there! Would be a shame to cover them up. Varnish sounds good  

I understand that it wouldn't be in keeping with the rest of the install and the existing trim looks amazing anyway.

The seas mids look great, you are going to enjoy some sweet mid bass

Really cheeky request but would you sell the 6" pods?