Story and a rant about Police

Steve_Matthews said

Can I suggest you just hang around and go drinking with harder mates?

If someone gives it and you back down with a "sorry, I'm not interested" or "whatever mate" you are showing weakness and they are going to do something, init.

If we were out and a gang of lads started offering us drugs and asking for change, other than one of the girls taking their drugs off them in exchange for nothing whatsoever, they'd be getting told to F* Off out of our hood and probably chased.

As for the lads in the bar giving it, well a few weeks ago my bro was in the loos when six lads started saying Geordies are all softies.  He came storming out in a right rage, stormed into the Kebab shop.  Grabbed me and Rob then we went and found Ash.  The group of Geordie haters were by now outside the bar and had swelled in numbers to about nine.  When presented with two angry Geordies plus two lemon southerners they soon changed their tune.  Even comiserating in the state of play at Newcastle United at the moment and telling us we were sound.  With people like this, remember it's all just a front.  If they do hit you and get a lucky shot in, you could be in for it so just bark louder!  Give it and they'll back down.  Safe one bruv!

PS.  You wouldn't believe at how effective a northern accent is when addressing lemon southerners!

What does that mean exactly `lemon southerners` ??

Sorry - I've been in Thanet too long.

Lemon as in aggy, angry, upset, shouty…

Lemons get squished! lol

Steve_Matthews said

Sorry - I've been in Thanet too long.

Lemon as in aggy, angry, upset, shouty…

Lemons get squished! lol

Oh right,i thought you were doing the `soft southerner` routine…

Ner, there are some very hard southerners - usually the lasses! ha ha

Hard as nails some of them! lol

LOL  

re the police they do a hard job, in simple terms they can go to wrk with the best intentions of dealing with a job i.e. yours simon and end up dealing with something else. Sadly its not a clerical/normal kind of job, they cannot be sure if and when they know what will happen, criminals dont work 9-5 sadly.

i am sure that they are keen to speak to you and collect all of the early evidence, too look into potential suspects, cctv etc, to get a good account whilst it is still fresh in your mind.

On another more salient point, it disheartens me about how people (not saying anyone in particular) may pay reference to the police not being any good, useless etc. They do an extremely difficult job, and if you switched the bill off for a few minutes and learnt what really goes on you may realise that its not all cops and robbers, there is a lot more too it.

wazzy said

that is utter discusting just goes to show what a shower of s*ite our police force is  

Oh dear………..Large male chicken time

I wonder what people would say if the Fire Service started prioitising calls and simply not turning up to fires where people were only going to sustain minor injuries!

In the case described at the begining of this email, the Police have been worse than useless and I can't see how, looking soley at this individual case, you can defend their behaviour.

Steve_Matthews said

In the case described at the begining of this email, the Police have been worse than useless and I can't see how, looking soley at this individual case, you can defend their behaviour.

I don't see how you can write them off looking at one individual event. 1 piece of research doesn't make the case mate. If any coppers came on and said that the way the police acted was shocking, fair enough, but they haven't as far I can see.

This sort of thing probably happens all over the country every weekend, and probably numerous times in every major city. Just because the resources are lacking and they can't get to one incident they do not become "disgusting" or "useless". Nor does this apply just because you don't agree with the necessary priorities.

As other people have already said, I don't really think it's fair for anyone to write them off when they don't know the whole story.

tyeness said

Steve_Matthews said

In the case described at the begining of this email, the Police have been worse than useless and I can't see how, looking soley at this individual case, you can defend their behaviour.

I don't see how you can write them off looking at one individual event. 1 piece of research doesn't make the case mate. If any coppers came on and said that the way the police acted was shocking, fair enough, but they haven't as far I can see.

This sort of thing probably happens all over the country every weekend, and probably numerous times in every major city. Just because the resources are lacking and they can't get to one incident they do not become "disgusting" or "useless". Nor does this apply just because you don't agree with the necessary priorities.

As other people have already said, I don't really think it's fair for anyone to write them off when they don't know the whole story.

Who says I'm writing off the Police.  I'M NOT!

I'm saying that in this case, they have been worse than useless.  I don't think anyone can argue with that can they?

Steve,

Say they took Simon's statement tomorrow, they'd already gathered the CCTV evidence, done the research into who their suspects were and went and nicked them tomorrow evening (after the statement had been taken and therefore had the complaint in writing), interviewed them, charged, remanded them to court and they went to prison on remand until trial……

Would that be useless, hopeless etc?????

What I'm saying is that GOOD evidence takes time. Sure they could have arrested some lads, they may not have been the right ones (time wasted). There could be loads of reason why we haven't heard about the end of tale up to now.

Policing isn't an easy job. Its easy to bash the cops because the public expect them to solve all their problems, usually ones that have been boiling up for years until BANG! everything erupts and they get called. Then…. its get the magic wand out and DO SOMETHING !!!

The Fire Service only have ONE response grade and that Blues and Twos to every job. (I stand to be corrected by Walt here  :wink: ) Thats why you always see them burning through town making a racket!!!! Oh look a Frire Engine, our heros!!! They won't save you when you're in a scrap or have been burgled!!!!! Good at putting out fires, cutting you out of the car when you've gone off the road…. and plastering!!! Rubbish at finding out who nicked your stereo!!!!!

AND THEY SLEEP ON NIGHTS !!!!!!!  

Dan

the difference between the fire service is that they are a reactive force, as the police are and are alos proactive.

The police get alot of abuse from people as quite frankly, people do not understnd the hurdles and difficulties in the job that they do.

its not like i say an episode of the bill where everything is done in 50 mins, statements can take hours too write!

so please dont be harsh on the police if you dont know all the facts, each case has to be judged on its own merits, and dont blame the police if you get caught for speeding, you know the rules, break them, and who can you blame?

Steve_Matthews said

tyeness said

Steve_Matthews said

In the case described at the begining of this email, the Police have been worse than useless and I can't see how, looking soley at this individual case, you can defend their behaviour.

I don't see how you can write them off looking at one individual event. 1 piece of research doesn't make the case mate. If any coppers came on and said that the way the police acted was shocking, fair enough, but they haven't as far I can see.

This sort of thing probably happens all over the country every weekend, and probably numerous times in every major city. Just because the resources are lacking and they can't get to one incident they do not become "disgusting" or "useless". Nor does this apply just because you don't agree with the necessary priorities.

As other people have already said, I don't really think it's fair for anyone to write them off when they don't know the whole story.

Who says I'm writing off the Police.  I'M NOT!

I'm saying that in this case, they have been worse than useless.  I don't think anyone can argue with that can they?

Maybe you should don some blue then mate if you have all the answers?

Some facts

The police service, of which many of you know i am part of  deals with hundreds upon hundreds of incidents every day

varying from complete waste of time calls that still take up and use precious resources, unfortunately it can be a hard slog to get to the conclussion its rubbish as every detail has to be listened to before that decision can be made, many many people bother the police with petty and quite frankly ridiculous woes which most people with 1/2 an ounce of sense could resolve of their own accord in 2 minutes

Every person reporting a crime does so as that is the most important thing to them as they are a victim, and the police are duty bound to investigate the complaint full to a conclusion.

The trouble when you ring, you may not be the only person who is calling, you may not be the only person who deems their call to be the most important in the country, everyone expects a good level of service, which is understandable and quite right, the problem is is the expectation of when and how that call is dealt with can sometimes be misconstrued as "the police not doing anything"

Lets just look at simons incident……

Simon and his mate are battered by some complete morons

He calls the police a while later, its saturday night and anyone who goes out clubbing etc knows what thats like…..the police officers on duty are probably already struggling to cope with the amount of normal calls coming through let alone all the extra ones that drink fueled violence that happens everywhere on friday and saturday nights up and down the country

Its not a case of not doing anything, its more a case of this, simon and his mate have been assaulted, nothing can change that sadly, 1, 2, 3 or 20 police cars will not change that!

The best opportunity to gather evidence is by speaking to 2 sober people and getting as much detail as they can, by finding out as much detail of description of the offenders as they can, by reviewing possibly hours of CCTV from cameras in the street and cameras in pubs these lads may have been in, by getting forensic photos of injuries etc etc

All this cannot happen in 5 minutes, the aim of an investigation is to prosecute offenders with best evidence in court, not to run round like headless chickens clutching at straws immediately after the event, its not practical, its not reasonable, in an ideal world yes! but their just are not enough coppers to do it!

Whilst everyone looks to have a go at the police for their percieved miss givings or failings, maybe you should be more discusted with the morons who carried out the assaults?

I find it perverse that people "bash" the police but hardly anyone berates the idiots that go around doing this sort of thing? the countrys emergency services need the support of the public

they are not perfect, but just remember all the people who do the jobs are humans, wether fire crews, police or ambulance

They are the ones who stand in the front line of the abuse, the assaults, the dangers, that many of the critiques wouldnt have the bottle or minerals to do quite frankly

So some support for the people who help wouldnt go a miss sometimes, fair enough critisize when you feel wronged personally but dont just jump on a bandwagon because its "bash the police time" because thats just sad

Nick,

In all fairness mate I wasn't really complaining about the lack of time they have as I do udnerstand it's a busy job and they all can't be there right away, it was just the way it was handled.

I'll write you a little list

1. They assumed KJ was the only one invovled as he was showing the marks
2. the incident was written down on 1/4 of a ripped peice of paper.
3. KJ didn't have a call back until I told them at the station
4. I had to wait 40 mins for something that was supposidly booked in


That's my only real complaints about it, I'm doing this not just for my jutice, just so another innocent person doesn't have to suffer.

I'm sorry Dano / Nick if I've caused you any un wanted stress cause of this post but as said, I just needed a vent >.<

Hang on a second.  If these kids were selling drugs how come that hadn't been jailed already?!

'coz I guarantee every single one of the scumbags will be known to the Police!

Getting the right person on the right charges and making it stick seems to be beyond the modern british law enforcement agencies.

I know officers who'll turn a blind eye if they see someone in breach of bail because it's more hassle and paperwork that it's worth to pick them up.  So what's the point?

…and me as a copper?  Sorry, I hate paperwork too much!

Steve_Matthews said

Getting the right person on the right charges and making it stick seems to be beyond the modern british law enforcement agencies.

I know officers who'll turn a blind eye if they see someone in breach of bail because it's more hassle and paperwork that it's worth to pick them up.  So what's the point

No it isn't Steve. lots of charges are spot on first time, everytime. By the time they get to court and the barristers have a chat and work out what the accused will plead to - thereby saving a trial AND earning themselves more money in the process - the indictments get changed to (usually) something lower than originally charged. THAT ISN'T THE POLICE'S REMIT.

The police collect the evidence, present in the best possible way to the CPS who then decide on a charge or not. The actual process of the police charging on anything other than a minor offence has long gone - about 2 years ago or so.

Regarding the bail issue - yes you're quite right there ARE some right lazy copper - and don't we all hate them for it. They aren't respected 'in house' and usually get the duff jobs when things are being dealt out.
Now look at it this way, say there was a lad who was on a curfew for something or other and say I knew him from previous dealings. i see him out after his time and stop him. He knows I could take him in but instead I stick him in the car and take him home. Quick word in his ear and all that and in return he tells me who is burgling the local schools, nicking projectors.

What do you want me to do with my time? Deal with a breach of bail that will take 4 hours to complete (on a good night) OR start the process of locking up the school burglers????

This kind of situation occurs time and time again and the people who make a big deal of 'not talking to the cops' actually do when the chips are down. The 'I dont grass' mentality only goes so far.

I've been thinking, rather than bang on about what the cops do wrong in Simons thread, why don't I start a new one entitled

'Free pop at cops here'?

Dan

Steve,

You will be right that they are known to Police.

However it doesn't matter how many times they are arrested, the courts will still let them off with a fine they cannot pay, no rehab and no help.

The Police collects all the evidence, CPS bring it to court, the Judge decides the end results and not the Police like many people think.

So many points, but the bottom line after all said and done is this, The police have a hard job and I am glad they showed up when I was assaulted, there are some bad some good as stated, and like it's been pointed out that it's down to the C.P.S to prosecute and deals will be struck, even the judges hands are tied by the politicians of over crowding prisons. Instead of fixing what is fundamentally a broken society, we keep having quick fixes.
whats the answer?
maybe time for a new post!!!!!!

chortle said

So many points, but the bottom line after all said and done is this, The police have a hard job and I am glad they showed up when I was assaulted, there are some bad some good as stated, and like it's been pointed out that it's down to the C.P.S to prosecute and deals will be struck, even the judges hands are tied by the politicians of over crowding prisons. Instead of fixing what is fundamentally a broken society, we keep having quick fixes.
whats the answer?
maybe time for a new post!!!!!!

Good sensible round up there mate….

Lets move on and wait for the outcome of Simon's investigation.

Now did I tell you about my Cabby…………………