Why the site has been down, how you may help!!

Early-1800 said

I think we are on a slippery slope if we start to get into arguments about picking and choosing what the subs are spent on. It’s like saying I’m going to pay 10% less tax as that’s what the govn spend on weapons and I don’t like it.

The club organisers are voted for and the club has aways run a website and AGM so subscribers can’t claim not to know where their £ is spent. If they don’t agree that much they can stop (or never start) paying their joining fee. It’s bit like cutting your nose off though.

I’ve been a member for most of the life of the club and for a year £15 or £20 doesn’t really make that much difference.  For me it’s is good value for money but there are other sites I use (Land Rover, Ford Fester, DBTC) occasionally and would struggle to justify even a £15 fee. There will be similar MK1 Golf posters that find the same here.

Think I’ve been to 3 AGMs and a couple of NEC classic shows and enjoyed them all but compared to standing on a windswept Gaydon car park, events like Uttoxeter are brilliant, even if only attending 1 day. 150 cars is an impressive result.

I think more effort should be spent on coming up with carrots and sticks to get the 100+posters to sign up.

It is a tricky one, restrictions mean that expert advice and good items for sale etc go elsewhere or never get aired anywhere. But relying on goodwill also means that some people never get around to it.  I much prefer encouragement rather than coercion and there are some clever people on here so lets try and come up with some positive ideas instead of getting into a slanging match.

early 1800 thank you thats what i've tryed to say and you put it in a one liner in there that sums it up,

i think more effort should be spent on ……………………….


and someone else pointed out those that can afford to pay more why aint they donating the extra bit, i'm now waiting on the clever clogs to say they do becuase i challanged that

dano no one disputing the agm is good but with out this forum the agm would not hold its own, and to say anything less would be a let down to be frank is aload off odd spanners sir, i thought this club was about the cars the people that drive those cars not the fact that the agm is posh and has tolets a mtr away, yes the vaule of things go  but i dont have to be a member like someone said this for forum is free i have not gained by being a member, i know it costs to run a forum so i decided i'd chip in and become a member, i even said at the time the discounts would not effect me and would rather just donate, but i got dig from someone becuase i had to started to run the motm which would look bad for the club to a non member running a section so i went along with it,

dano it may or may not be comon knowledge what your job is on here, but certainly your in much better paid job then most off on here and the extra £5 dont affect you and to say those argruing about a£5 price hike should perhaps not own such a old car i find very offensive i would not dare tell you wot car you can drive becuase you have money or dont have money, people own a car like this becuase there crazy about them, they might off brought a £300 pound rust bucket that just goes threw a mot each year and looks i sore to look at, cos that all they can afford but what rights have you got to say maybe  they should not drive a old car if they moan about £5  

your opening line was

I go totally against what you're saying there since_1983. And as you say, nothing personal but once you've seen things 'from within' you get a different perspective on the club.

but you just made that whole statement personal back to god knows how many users

and to be honest i'm offended becuase i for one would rather drive round in a car i love and really could not afford to make look like new then not live the dream at all

There are so many different opinions and no one is saying that you have to go to the AGM, wether the Club funds, Membership go towards that, some of the cost is offset by the entrance fee to the AGM, any way. Like I said I am happy to pay My £15.00 and the entrance fee, that's my Personal choice and I am not saying other folks have to go or agree on what the money gets spent on or even be a member at all. The Club is here and I beleive a lot of people would of struggled without the forums, the list of contributors could go on for ever, over the years people have come and gone but given and left the knowledge behind, so that's the spirit of how a Club should be. The Club is on the right track as the Golf + magazine rated it as one on the best MK1 Golf Clubs as a mainstay to keeping the Golf alive.
I met loads of people at the AGM and the kindness of help from Jelly and I gained one more Member for the club.
It cost a bottle of water, I helped a bloke who travelled all way from Scotland, who broke down just outside the Race Course.
he needed a top hose which we got from a Trader, and borrowed the tools to do the Job from someone else.
That's Club spirit.
The Club should benefit everyone and to isolate how and what the money goes on would undermine the essence of it.
Sure I don't like how my Tax money gets spent, but it goes on to provide for a Society, wether I want it to or not, be spent on what goes against my own values..
My original point of the costs of Membership as to what you get (should you wish to take up the benefits offered) outweighs what you have learned from the forums, compared to how much getting a Garage to fix a problem for you.
I am going to take a guess here there is not many people on here who cannot say that have not saved money by visiting the site wether they are a paid member or not, I am going to take a guess here, there may not be many who have posted on this very thread I personally have not helped with something. That is in the Clubs Spirit, why? because that's how we learn and grow as people.
The Fact you have a MOTM, bears this out.
So yes Costs go up and the Club will have needs that will grow, and to stiffle that would be a shame.
If the Membership goes up, it goes up, that's inflation.
Insofar as people making further donations aside from their Membership (wether they are better off or not) is a bit like charging people for the info on the forums, to find a solution to the problems they have with their car what ever it's value to them.
I mean post up my engine won't run etc and send them to the locked section and then charge them an unlock fee, to get the info they need, you would soon see the google hit count go and people leave the Club, as it's not in the clubs spirit. There has to be a balance.
So as being a Member is not compulsory to use this site, many will not be a paid Member, but will have the very knowledge they need to keep their Car going.
So it may be the few pay, for the many who do not.
I have bought an umbrella, airfreshners, stickers etc from the Club and if it makes a few pence for the running then I am happy to of done that. It maybe that I am lucky enough to have the money spare, to buy those things.
Peace out fellow Golf lovers…

My twopennorth….

I'm happy to pay my membership although I use very few of the benefits, I was happy when it was £20 tbh, but thats my personal view.

I think its a fair point that has been made that the donation button should be visible. A lot of people might like to donate a bit extra when they have found something particularly useful, especially if it has saved them money in the long run, whether they are a paid member or not. I've done so in the past when Russ's cabby roof replacement guide proved invaluable to us.

Its also a very good point that the membership info and buy link should be a very visible part of the page. It may not have been thought of before as committee members renew via the email reminder, so we've had no need.

Also, the call for more people to become paid members isn't purely to fund the AGM, yes, that costs money but is something that I feel (personal opinion again) is important. as we as a club are so widely spread that it helps us have the club atmosphere we have to provide people with the opportunity to meet up with people they have chatted to online but would not normally meet face to face.

Funds are needed to secure the future of this club. We do need to move to a dedicated server. This will cost more than it currently does, and we need to know that those funds are available and secure, not just immediately, but ongoing for the future. The fact that we find ourselves in this position at all is testament to how amazing this club, the people who are part of it, and the information that everyone shares is.

I'm sure there won't be any change for changes sake, and hopefully most of us will be able to support the decisions that are made for our club.

I'll shut up now  :mrgreen:

the trouble is how i see it and i dont always do a great job off explanning, fine up the price and in 12 months time instead of 470 members paying £15 which is 7050 all u have to do is scare off 118.5 people paying membership at £20 and we are back to where we started, and revisiting this topic upping costs again losing more memberships resulting in upping the cost again,
if this was a bussiness the bank manger would say shut shop


 the point is the club is not making the money thats needed to keep self suffecent, fine hide this with higher membership cost your just covering the problem

and to be fair if all 470 people did pay the extra amount the club is asking for, you are quids in ur asking 1200 to keep the site running smoothly weather this  is on top off what you pay now or thats the new price for better server, 470 * 5 is 2350 so its slight over kill on that count where the extra fee should be more like another £2.56 each which is off a more friendly hike in price,

the the thing that really bugs me about this and is started to make me wonder there have been a number off ways put forward which would aid the club funds and non off you top guys are willing to accept them or talk about them, there back out the door as fast there mention,

the only idea that has stuck is membership option is not visable and donation button also not very clear, why dont you guys act on them amit a mistake has been made review the sitution again in 6 months

instead off pushing this price increase,

and lets be totaly honest here we are 2months away from a huge online serge off cabby owners wonted to get there car ready for hood down action and needing help from this forum, and in return with a better visual donation and membership option you might see a increase in the paid members number,

for crist sake this topic has been brought to light for a very short time publicly in this forum and already there are inprovements to be made which u must act on and yet to up the price aswell in my mind is wrong to do at this stage

as i've said solve the solution dont cover it becuase when it hits the forum again whos really gonna be intrested there gonna ingnore it

just to follow on from that there are people willing to pay more and dont mind this increase, and to be fair i dont mean to make a rift between myself and these people jelly chortle you both a good pals on here to me you both have served me well when i needed advise or knowledge about things, i've already pm'd andy on this matter, cos i am being sod on this matter i really hope this altors nothing between us around the forum and that if needed you would still offer your help/advise, and anyone else for that matter,

To say none of the ideas brought to light in this thread are not going to be acted on is a bit harsh.
Give people chance.

Some of the ideas were already in the pipeline anyway, the shop for example is already installed, the new membership page is installed, ok not ready yet but still there
Take a look , Work in progress membership page
this has the automatically recur your membership option mentioned in this thread earlier, so to say stuff is not happening is not right.
 
Most figures in this thread are not correct anyway.

Can I just say something else here, this site and club is not going to go bust and in my opinion is self sufficient now

Anyway, hopefully by the time you guys read this we will be on the new server.

Thanks Mark

since_1983 said

just to follow on from that there are people willing to pay more and dont mind this increase, and to be fair i dont mean to make a rift between myself and these people jelly chortle you both a good pals on here to me you both have served me well when i needed advise or knowledge about things, i've already pm'd andy on this matter, cos i am being sod on this matter i really hope this altors nothing between us around the forum and that if needed you would still offer your help/advise, and anyone else for that matter,

I don't fall out with people. We are all entitled to an opinion. If you have Identified issues that would help the Club with it's membership and funds, then that's good.
Maybe there needs to be a slighlty different layout as to where buttons are for donations and Membership to help boost the funds.
I don't have an answer how the web stuff works, I can only just upload piccies etc.
I am not sure if you have website experience advice to offer on how to implement the ideas suggested, but if you do then sending a PM to the website team would be fantastic.
I am sure the extra help/ideas would be appreciated.
It is hard work and a thankless task that the folks have when running the Club and maybe some folks, don't understand the time, effort and hardwork that goes into running the Cub.
Perhaps we should look at it as "Not what the club can do for us, but what we can do for the Club"

"and lets be totaly honest here we are 2months away from a huge online serge off cabby owners wonted to get there car ready for hood down action and needing help from this forum, and in return with a better visual donation and membership option you might see a increase in the paid members number,"

Perhaps I could charge per answer to a question then give that the Club…lol only kidding but I could not resist it, sorry  :redfaced:  :redfaced:  :redfaced:  :redfaced:  :redfaced:      

since_1983 said

dano no one disputing the agm is good but with out this forum the agm would not hold its own, and to say anything less would be a let down to be frank is aload off odd spanners sir, i thought this club was about the cars the people that drive those cars not the fact that the agm is posh and has tolets a mtr away, yes the vaule of things go  but i dont have to be a member like someone said this for forum is free i have not gained by being a member, i know it costs to run a forum so i decided i'd chip in and become a member, i even said at the time the discounts would not effect me and would rather just donate, but i got dig from someone becuase i had to started to run the motm which would look bad for the club to a non member running a section so i went along with it

Reply -

I would dispute that the AGM wouldn't hold its own without forum. Possibly the other way round. The social scene is what makes this club successful. Regional meets, drive outs and the AGM all help to hold it together. The AGM has a road rally on the Saturday, how much more 'about the cars that the people drive' can you get? Over 88 cars all going out together gives everyone a massive boost and serves to say 'Yes I was right to keep going on the car because here I am - driving it'.
My comment regarding toilets etc are valid because if you'd have come to Uttoxeter last year, you'd know how far the way will be as we move futher down the field THIS year! Believe me, they aren't posh toilets - they are necessary for the members.

since_1983 said

dano it may or may not be comon knowledge what your job is on here, but certainly your in much better paid job then most off on here and the extra £5 dont affect you and to say those argruing about a£5 price hike should perhaps not own such a old car i find very offensive i would not dare tell you wot car you can drive becuase you have money or dont have money, people own a car like this becuase there crazy about them, they might off brought a £300 pound rust bucket that just goes threw a mot each year and looks i sore to look at, cos that all they can afford but what rights have you got to say maybe  they should not drive a old car if they moan about £5

Reply -

My job is fairly common knowledge with the members. I don't hide it anymore (I did keep it relatively quiet at first because its not everyones favourite profession!  :redfaced: )
Pay is all relevant to what your outgoings are. You live to your income. At the end of the month my pocket will be empty just as yours will be. At the start of the month it gets filled up again. What I was say is that IF money is tight then perhaps an old car isn't the right hobby to be taking on. Its simply ecconomics (paul_c jump in any time you like with a graph!!!   ).

It has been mentioned that those who wish to can donate extra funds. You may be thinking, 'Dano can afford to donate so why doesn't he?' Well I think that I do donate more than my subscription. The amount of running around that I (and all the other committee members do) uses diesel, wear and tear on the car, my time is taken up etc so yes I do donate.
What we are asking is that the HEAVY forum users consider becoming PAID members. They are taking from the club, enjoying the site and not putting back into it.

We all know that our cars need welding, parts, bodywork etc and some, as you say, will only just scrape through the MOT each year. But to say that £5.00 increase is too much when a cabby boot lock seal on ebay is going for £5.00, then I find that its at odds with your argument. Members get a lot of enjoyment and entertainment and knowledge from the site so is it a great hardship to ask for £20 subscription?

I'm not saying what car people should drive but if they choose to own an older car then potential expensive maintence bills may follow.

since_1983 said

your opening line was

I go totally against what you're saying there since_1983. And as you say, nothing personal but once you've seen things 'from within' you get a different perspective on the club.

but you just made that whole statement personal back to god knows how many users

and to be honest i'm offended becuase i for one would rather drive round in a car i love and really could not afford to make look like new then not live the dream at all

Reply -

This is a forum, a place for debate. If you have differing views from mine I'm not going to be offended by them! We are here to exchange opinions and thats whats going on. I was mearly addressing you and your points. This thread is open to everyone and if I get shot down for my opinion then so be it!!!!

I hope my replys don't offend you any further, that not my intention. Straight speaking has that effect on people though!!!!  :wink:

:roll:  :roll:

What proportion of the membership fee goes towards the AGM ? If it's the website that is suffering and this forum is frequented by more people than the AGM then perhaps a re-distribution of funds would be wise. I guess it's the hardcore and local Mk1 Owners who go to the show so perhaps that should be managed with a one off charge for those attending.

saying that people should pay and put back into the club is like saying that the more knowledgeable ones who help everybody the best they can with anwering questions and the like shouldn't have to pay because they already put more than there fair share back in, i think the only way around this is to just push more into paying the £15, push the merchandise more etc

i'm trying to explain this from a neutral point of view i luckily enough can afford to pay the extra if thats the way it goes and i buy the merchandise (why i need a white and a red umbrella is beyond me but hey ho if its for the good of the forum thats fine) but the rest needs a big sales pitch, and like someone else said maybe more advertising, i read somewhere that a well known golf magazine rated this site one of the best so why ain't they advertising on here ?? i can put up with a few adds if it helps the forum out …

mAtt- said

saying that people should pay and put back into the club is like saying that the more knowledgeable ones who help everybody the best they can with anwering questions and the like shouldn't have to pay because they already put more than there fair share back in, i think the only way around this is to just push more into paying the £15, push the merchandise more etc

i'm trying to explain this from a neutral point of view i luckily enough can afford to pay the extra if thats the way it goes and i buy the merchandise (why i need a white and a red umbrella is beyond me but hey ho if its for the good of the forum thats fine) but the rest needs a big sales pitch, and like someone else said maybe more advertising, i read somewhere that a well known golf magazine rated this site one of the best so why ain't they advertising on here ?? i can put up with a few adds if it helps the forum out …

brilliant!

As what mAtt just said - I haven't read every post in here but I would not expect memebership money go the AGM - Surely the ticket prices for the AGM should break you even for the event?

We saying it, the clubs ISN'T broke!!! There isn't a financial problem.

Dubpartz, there is a gate fee for those attending so thy goes towards paying for the event.

It's well known that shows dont make a profit in the first few years.

Matt, the advertisers are here to offer discounts to paid members. They are happy to offer the discounts but more reluctant to pay for the advertising. If we insisted on making them pay for the advertising then we'd lose the members discounts. What do you want more???
I'd say more discounts for everyone.

This thread was an attempt to persuade the hardcore, long term non paid members to join up. Those users who have been using the club as a source of entertainment or information for years without paying up!!!!!

i fully understand how you have worked the discounts for members instead of them paying to advertise, and i for one havn't used any of that yet but i will and i understand that the club isn't broke or it wouldn't be here now i was just trying to suggest ways of improving things for you guys financially, and i'm working my bits off to get my golf ready for the AGM which i will be attending for the first time this year so don't want you to lose that either i just thought a little advertising from elsewhere would maybe help out

and as for more members paying i think it is money well spent if they read the tech sections and all they do is something simple like there own oil change/ service they have more than saved the cost of membership plus the said discounts associated with membership its a no brainer surely ??

i think this thread has been taken out of context by a lot of people and should be closed in all honesty because it seems to be going round in circles and winding a few people up

if i have said anything to upset anyway it was not intended that way and i will appologise in advance

KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK !!!!!!!!!!!!

Matt-

All good with me Matt!!! No complaints here.

Glad to hear that your car is coming along to the AGM. The more the merrier!

dano lets forget the pervouis thoughts between us and lock onto this then,

but one less thing thou

i personaly think the agm would not hold its own as u need this club of mk1 owners to attend with out the club no meet would even be held in honesty,


right then!!!!


your statement says

We saying it, the clubs ISN'T broke!!! There isn't a financial problem.

then why are we having a debate about the club needing more money then and the talk off membership going up

I would hazard a guess that it goes something like this, we need some facts and figures to make a good call on this:

(1) Moving to a new server will increase the drain on club funds - can we be told by how much ? How many paid members at £15 does the club need to sustain the AGM and keep this site running ?
(2) One way to fund (1) and keep the clubs bank balance healthy would be to have a greater number of paid up members.
(3) The chairman pointed out that there are quite a lot of 100+ a day posters that are not members, if these joined then (2) might be satisfied.
(4) If (3) does not happen then membership will need to increase to keep the club financially secure.

In answer/query to above….

1. …or more income from other streams, eg donations, merchandise, other; or less spending on other items
2. I'm not sure anyone posts 100+ a day. In any case, in the grand scheme of things the forum use is only a proportion of the resources used. There's not that many new posts made per day, so maybe something else is/was draining the resources.
3. If membership fee increases, number of members will decrease (price elasticity of demand). It would require a market test to determine the optimal price of membership, for club income.

(2) Agreed - Membership is the only one that has a good history to make it more predicatble. I would like to see a proper merchandising virtual shop, not 5 minutes worth of work to manage though, difficult when this is all voluntary.
(3) I think the point is just that those making most usage of the forum for free are viewed as the ones that should now start to contribute with hard cash. I guess that is a bit like donating for some free software because you get so much out of it and want the time/creativity of the author to be recognised - the choice is always yours to make though.
(4) Not necessarily true if every current member renews - ok if it was put up to £50 then you are spot on. There will also be new members who don't know any difference and will see £20 as the norm.