102 RON?

ew said

What about avation fuel, any good in cars?

Avgas comes in 3 generally available grades: 80/87, 100/130 and 100LL. The 100/130 and 100LL are approx 108RON, so you could optimise an engine for it and it would run better even than the BP 102 stuff.

Other fuels used in aircraft are Mogas (ie small planes, they use the same fuel as cars), and for turbine engines (eg jets and turboprops) Jet A, Jet A1 and Jet B. The jet fuels are closer to diesel than petrol in their composition.

There's also other, more specialised fuels, for military use and which have historically been available in the past.

ew said

Jet fuel is Kerosene based, aviation fuel is Petroleum based with octane content up to 145 8O

you may have to fit an after market after burner to feel the benefit.

A5OPY said

ew said

Jet fuel is Kerosene based, aviation fuel is Petroleum based with octane content up to 145 8O

you may have to fit an after market after burner to feel the benefit.

You wouldn't be the first by a long chalk!

Tian :mrgreen:

paul_c said

ew said

What about avation fuel, any good in cars?

Avgas comes in 3 generally available grades: 80/87, 100/130 and 100LL. The 100/130 and 100LL are approx 108RON, so you could optimise an engine for it and it would run better even than the BP 102 stuff.

Other fuels used in aircraft are Mogas (ie small planes, they use the same fuel as cars), and for turbine engines (eg jets and turboprops) Jet A, Jet A1 and Jet B. The jet fuels are closer to diesel than petrol in their composition.

There's also other, more specialised fuels, for military use and which have historically been available in the past.

quick google search was it! haha

Paul said

ew said

What about avation fuel, any good in cars?

Avgas comes in 3 generally available grades: 80/87, 100/130 and 100LL. The 100/130 and 100LL are approx 108RON, so you could optimise an engine for it and it would run better even than the BP 102 stuff.

Other fuels used in aircraft are Mogas (ie small planes, they use the same fuel as cars), and for turbine engines (eg jets and turboprops) Jet A, Jet A1 and Jet B. The jet fuels are closer to diesel than petrol in their composition.

There's also other, more specialised fuels, for military use and which have historically been available in the past.

Paul will you be my phone a friend?  but remember you only have a few seconds to give the answer.

most cars will see no advantage from running 102 RON fuel, especially those with basic ECUs.

You may feel a tiny bit more urgency at low revs and maybe it'll hang onto the revs a tiny bit more at the top end, but nothing more.

Unless your car is mapped to make use of the extra octane, it will be wasted.

a normally aspirated car would struggle to run enough ignition advance to make use of the extra, but a turbo car would probably get another couple of degrees from it. However, you're then into the realms of det, with all the associated issues it brings.

What the extra octane DOES allow you to do on a turbo car is run at decent boost without the onset of detonation. Great for trackdays, especially in summer.

However, you don't need to lash out a fortune on BP102 - just use V-Power or Tesco 99 and a decent octane booster like Millers - you can easily get 101 with that.

alexHxC said

paul_c said

ew said

What about avation fuel, any good in cars?

Avgas comes in 3 generally available grades: 80/87, 100/130 and 100LL. The 100/130 and 100LL are approx 108RON, so you could optimise an engine for it and it would run better even than the BP 102 stuff.

Other fuels used in aircraft are Mogas (ie small planes, they use the same fuel as cars), and for turbine engines (eg jets and turboprops) Jet A, Jet A1 and Jet B. The jet fuels are closer to diesel than petrol in their composition.

There's also other, more specialised fuels, for military use and which have historically been available in the past.

quick google search was it! haha

Yeah something like that! But there you go, ew was right, you could run a car on aviation fuel. I imagine the spoiler would be that its not taxed as road fuel and you'd not be able to drive to the area of an airport to put it into your car.

Neighbour has avgas for his plane, wondered if it was worth a crack.  A cracked head probably

could syphon it off while hes not looking haha

If you're after higher than normal octane rating fuel, you can buy it, eg from the people who supply it to race teams, etc.

like tht nitrus fuel they use in drag cars?

alexHxC said

like tht nitrus fuel they use in drag cars?

Yeah

?2.42 a litre?  That's Unbelievable…

It would cost me, and most of you  :mrgreen: about ?80-90 to fill up once.

Sorry but that's well out of my price range.




OK, once the engine is sorted and she's running as she should, I can't say I won't be tempted….  

paul_c said

alexHxC said

like tht nitrus fuel they use in drag cars?

Yeah

coz i thought after using such high octane fuel it ruins the engine thats why they have to rebuild em after every race.

nope the stuff they run in funnycars and drag cars is methonol which is a very light fuel with no oil in it. they rebuild after each run because of the tolerences they run to get the sort of performance they need.

novocaine said

nope the stuff they run in funnycars and drag cars is methonol which is a very light fuel with no oil in it. they rebuild after each run because of the tolerences they run to get the sort of performance they need.

Methanol is used in Top Methanol Funny Cars and Top Methanol Dragsters, these engines typically produce 2500-3000bhp and are rebuilt around every 10-20 runs, or when they blow up, whichever is sooner. Top Fuel Dragsters run on nitromethane and produce around 6000bhp or more. These get a top end rebuild every run, and also the main bearings are taken apart and put back together again to check for wear, etc.

The main reason they are so unreliable/rebuilt so often is that they're racing, so everything is pushed right to the limit. In practice this means that the supercharger produces very high pressures (the compression ratio isn't acutally that much) and this means more fuel can be injected. Nitromethane has a very wide range of stiochiometry in which it burns properly too. The way nitromethane burns too, is different than petrol or methanol - its a monopropellant, in that its own composition provides the oxygenation to burn it, given the right conditions (high pressure). The advantage in this fuel all results in an 'exlosion' in the cylinder an order of magnitude greater than any other typical engine. This produces all the power, but also the big blowups which are not uncommon.

learned something new. cheers paul.

hmm want some to try now quite fancy blowing apart a 20vt head  :wink:

I don't think a normal engine would even run on nitromethane, I'd imagine it would bend the rod or crank, or blow the head off, within about 20 revolutions of the engine once the throttle is opened up. That or the ignition system would never light it in the first place. (The ignition system really is the key to high power, on a modern top fueller).