Paying members vs freeloaders

Other business prevents me from attending the AGM however after a long conversation with Drew et al. it is apparent that the club is somewhat unbalanced.

Around 120 members provide financial support to the efforts of the committee whilst the forum is open to all. Methinks that something is going wrong.

Whilst the main effort within the club is the forum, it could be considered that the few are paying for the many and that the balance needs to be redressed.

One immediate answer is to restrict certain features of the forum to paying members, this would not be popular but at least it would start the ball rolling in the right direction.

Another method to increase income is more paying members generated by advertising and attending shows. However what can we offer to potential paying members that is not available to the forum for nothing?

I paid up due to the excellent buying guides and advice, ?20 is nothing for such a geat resource. I save that in buying an excellent car!!!

One Idea up for discussion, It may cause a stir, Limit the number of posts for non-members :dontknow:

Why user do not pay up if they use the site allot is beyond me, If you want to play…please pay…..you may loose it!!!

Rob

IMO the forum should be open to all - the definition of forum is "A public meeting place for open discussion"

I offer advice to people on here when they ask for it, for free, and when I need advice I can bank on someone helping me out, for free. It's perfect.

Your ?20 buys you other things - insurance discounts, car stickers, free or reduced entry to events, etc… so you don't have to try very hard to make your money back.

At the moment whether you choose to pay or not, you're on a winner.

I am not sure it is that unbalanced between "freeloaders" and paid up members. Membership is excellent value for money considering the ?20 includes entry to maybe the best Mk1 show in the world, plus all the discounts. As long as membership fees are enough to keep the Club running at its current level then that is enough for me. If people want more from the Club or membership declines then maybe it needs to be looked at again.

We did try to restrict the Classifieds section of the forum to members, but it is not so easy to implement in practice and the majority wanted it FOC so the idea was dropped.

The aim of the Club is to keep Mk1s on the road, and as the forum greatly contributes to that by helping owners with their problems (even though they may not be forum regulars) then that is fine by me.

I am a freeloader!!!!!!

I agree that it does cost to buy the site, but you dont need to pay on any other site.

OK this is dedicated to Mk1 only so alot of info is available for the Mk1 but I could also get alot of help on E38 and there are alot of poeple from here that use that forum aswell for free.

I also have a Bora, a Beetle and until recently a Corrado, so I brouse alot of forums at no cost and no one else asks for any money.

It should be an indeviduals choice whether to pay or not and if they do then they can have the cheap tickets and other benifits.

Maybe you should look into how they support there forums and clubs.

A thead like this will only stir up bad feeling between those who pay and those who dont.

Lets face it there are alot of FREE forums out there, and making poeple feel bad about not paying will drive more away than make pay up.

TimHale said

Whilst the main effort within the club is the forum, it could be considered that the few are paying for the many and that the balance needs to be redressed.

So what you want is an exclusive paid membership forum. God thats so Club GTI, and that as a club is now dying.

First up 'freeloader' is a bit of an emotive term and you need to think about your terminology. Much of the advice and knowledge on this forum is given to members for free from so-called 'freeloaders'

I enjoy the Mk1 discussion here and also meeting like-minded people locally now and again. However, to be honest I'm not really interested in joining any club formally, at least not until the Campaign is finished.

In the days of the Campaign register I remember Drew asking for donations to keep the site running and plenty people did (I think !), me included. How about the opportunity to donate via Paypal for non-members as stage 1, and full membership as stage 2 ?  I'd certainly be up for that.

Limiting posts won't work. If someone puts up a 'how do I …..' and I know the answer, how am I going to help them out if I've run out of posts ?

Blocking classifieds won't work. If you're selling something and I want to buy it, you're going to miss out on a sale if I can't see your ad. Similarly, there have been a couple of people who have offered cars for free to a good home with their initial, 'non-member' post. Everyone looses out in one way or another.  

There are quite a few old faces here who are non-members, and much of the 'knowledge' surrounding Mk1's has been spread by them. Making people unwelcome is not the answer !

Mark

There is no easy answer to this, but, I'm in devils advocate mood tonight, Any non-web based car club yopu join you'd expect to pay. They print a monthly news letter/magazine. Car stickers, Insurance discounts and you get a wealth of info and facts. Why is  the internet deemed to be free, web servers cost, internet connections cost. Printing hard copies cost.

Why do people think the internet is totally free!!!

Its quick and instant but free it is not, support the people who want to support you in your chosen interest!

The only other option in selling advertising space and barrage us with unwanted special offers to help fund the running costs!!!

More food for thought, from someone who would prefer things to be free than to pay :wink:

Rob

Advertising is not the only other option. I'd happily help out with server costs by way of donation as I use this forum a lot. Like I said, loads of the help on here comes from non-members - the 'wealth of info and facts' you mention.  

Anyway, this is turning into an 'us and them' thing, so 'nuff said !

I think I understand both points of view!

I stumbled upon the Golf Mk1 Owners Club website yesterday and was very impressed by the welcome text, rules etc so went to get my credit card out to pay my ?20 membership fee so that I could access the rest of the site! I then realised that my ?20 would only last a few months as renewal appears to be on a fixed date and that I'd just missed an opportunity to go to what appears to be a cracking weekend at Gaydon. Hold on I thought, lets just see how much of the website I can access for now and was very surprised to find that I could access all of it!!! I will send my ?20 off I promise as I would like to support the cause - it's just I don't feel like paying an annual fee for what is in reality a couple of months.

Perhaps the real issue is this -
Make the membership worth paying for over & above what's on the website. The biggest car club in the world is the Jaguar Enthusiast Club (I was a member a couple of years ago) and they have a fantastic magazine, great access to tech info, special tools etc and, perhaps more importantly, a very strong regional set-up. I noticed that there is nothing under the Kent/Sussex region heading but loads under the Berkshire one?!

Ok I can hear you say that this all costs money but just think, if all the people who'd registered their cars paid for a membership each year then the club would have an income of ?20-?30k (allowing for people with more than one car). Also, the ads that people don't want on the web could be placed in the magazine where they are far less intrusive generating even more revenue!

Oh well just a thought
Philip
 

O dear . there be green grass on both sides here .  I only post on here to av a natter with a few people who r in the know with mk1`s and also to help people out with things that i have done and experienced .

I think the forum should remain free and open to all mk1 owners or people who offer advice on maitenence etc . for sure the club gti thing is a very valid point . when a good club for owners starts to lean toward becoming a money making venture opinions/attitudes often change .

this said though with they guys who run and moderate our site and do a good job of it  , there interist is in seeing the club move on to bigger and better things - naturally .

maybe the idea of a parts supply for mk1`s would be a good line to follow . this could provide a good turnover for the club and its members whilst allowing members to locate parts at a trade / members price .
whilst also incouraging the non members to join up and enjoy the benifits.
the flaw is here though that that cant happen without investment .

i think philspeed raised a valid point about the fixed registration date aswell , i know its only ?20 but it would be nice to get a years worth for your money .

another point is the seeming lack of interist in the meet up`s going on in kent , no one does anything ??

and im sure gaydon is a great weekend but - no disrespect i`d rather pay for entry and have a 1/4 mile , maybe a handling track like at gti international , some good trade stands mk1 auto jumbles and some live bands , im not saying turn it into bugjam but something a little more lively surly wouldnt hurt . dont forget we all have day jobs on here too and im sure there are people who could help organise an event like this .

this shouldnt be a vs issue though were all in this for more or less the same reasons .

I also agree about the fixed date membership issue.  I would join now if it wasn?t for that.

so membership isnt a year from when you joined?? :dontknow:

no , get a good discount with newton comercial though so im orgering a new interior on monday !  

So what if it's imbalanced?

For argument sake say around 20% of the regular contributors are paid members and the other 80% are "freeloaders". That means that 80% of the technical knowledge, information, rare parts for sale and general entertainment is being provided by the "freeloaders". My guess is that a lot of that resourse would be lost to other forums if it was members only.

Cutting off your nose to spite your face and all that…… :wink:

Membership run Jan to Jan - the main reason for this at the mo is to help administration of the rlatively small block of members and for ease of accounting.  As numbers grow it would make more sense to have a rolling 12 months for membership.

Remember the committee gives up their free time at no cost to run the club.  Also the club is quite youndg and needs to develop a bit more - but not too fast so it can be managed.

All the points above are valid and need considering as the club develops.

Cheers

Rich

Stew 72 wrote

That means that 80% of the technical knowledge, information, rare parts for sale and general entertainment is being provided by the "freeloaders".

Rather an unsustainable argument but under the circumstances, one to be expected.

I know what you are all saying, and its simple if you want to get discount etc and access to the members only section then become a member!
if you dont then dont become a member 8O
im not a paying member but i will be next year  :wink:
and i help wherever i can to paying members or " freeloaders" ….
i left the "club gti" forum because of too many "politics"
dont let this become one of the dying forums

Forgetting that membership fee is to join the club, surely its a nice gesture to 'donate' this fee to keep the club healthy and the site/show up and running?

I think its sad that more poeple don't, just out of choice.  I understand the point that it gets silly paying for all the clubs/forums that people are in, but a lot of people don't donate twards any.

Took some hassling from Wellsey/Phil to get me paying, but did, and what a warm fuzzy feeling it gives me:p.  This is the only club I pay towards.

The worst thing is when you get a 'them/us' mood.  It happened on CGTI and look at that now….serious decline.

I certainly will be voting against divided access. :mrgreen:

Hell!!! Iam reading with interest.

It seems that there is great deal of resentment from those unwilling to pay to supporting something that costs other people to provide for them, not a healthy state of affairs.

However I note that there is little or no constructive suggestions to generate income apart from advertising revenues.

May I suggest that a different approach to generate income is to actively recruit membership paying members, thereby providing the income that the club needs?

Those unwilling to pay can continue to enjoy the forum at other people's expense or until their conscience provides the impetus to become 'insiders' rather than taking advantage of the generosity of others.