Fixed! Clipper engine cut-out at 70mph on motorway.

Hi everyone,

Had a bit of a moment this morning - doing 70mph in my '92 Clipper (1.8, Pierburg carb) in the fast lane of the motorway.  As I took my foot off the accellerator pedal, the car cut out completely and died on me. Hazards on and with the help of my friendly fellow motorists moving out of the way, I made it to the hard shoulder and tried to restart it, but it failed.

Tried 5 mins later and it started - no problems.

Any ideas?

Could it be over/under fuelling at speed?  I kept an eye on the engine temp (recent new thermostat) and it's all fine, so I don't suspect head gasket failure.

I'll let the clever people guide me on this one! :-)

Thanks in advance.

Phil

weird! I recon its a carb issue, or maybe fuel pump or pump relay. if you had an intermittent pump problem this would fit your symptoms.

could be down to carb icing, check the warm air feed is connected and the flap opens while the engine is running. i nkow its a bit warmer out there but at speed you might have a fair bit of carb chilling due to the volumes of fuel involved.

it might also be a fuel delivery issue, if it happens again pop the fuel feed pipe off the carb and pop it into a clear container, crank it over brifly then see if any fuel comes out. obv be very carefull if you have a hot engine bay

Thanks guys - I suspect the carb - need to find someone that knows what they're doing to look into this. ( Any recommendations?)

I have a cold start problem as well, but thought it was the starter - now it seems the carb is playing up.

Phil

hi there matey
i,v came across this problem lots of times , check the valve in the air filter , the one that the vac pipe goes to they seize
suck throgh the vac pipe and check that the flap inside moves
hope you have joy ?

Thanks Xenon.  Will check the air filter valve.  Good tip!

Phil

Hi Xenon,

Checked the valve - looks OK.  Noticed the earth wire from the ignition coil was not connected to the rocker cover - now fixed. :-). Doubt that was the cause though…

Will take the car out next weekend to see if I can get it to cut out again.

Phil

Sounds like dirt in the fuel in the actual problem, the carb playing up will be a downstream consequence of it. You need to find how the dirt got in, most likely candidate is a rusty fuel filler neck. Or it could be something similar like the lift pump is clogged, or just worn out, etc.

kwaak said

Hi Xenon,

Checked the valve - looks OK.  Noticed the earth wire from the ignition coil was not connected to the rocker cover - now fixed. :-). Doubt that was the cause though…

Will take the car out next weekend to see if I can get it to cut out again.

Phil

Be careful!

We nearly died last week as we were at the kerb with our hazards on - and a young woman nearly piled into the back of us @ 70 mph. We were on our daily commute and our '91 clipper failed again.
We are experiencing exactly the same failure as you (maybe) but are much further down the list as it has troubled us for the past 4 months.

The engine dies 10 min's into the journey from cold - and feels like fuel starvation. But can also fail when it has sat on the drive to reach temperature before moving off.  Two weeks ago week drove 60 miles to Essex without a fault, stood in traffic, drove home 50 miles and it failed continually 10 miles from home!!!

Our clipper is a '91 1.8 clipper - 36k one previous owner (1,800 miles a year) full service hist' no expense spared. and we bought it last year and the same week drove it to the south of France and back with out the slightest hitch.

But a month later the filler cap went missing?  Its on the road somewhere along with the top of the filler neck which had rotted right through!!! The problems started some time after the replacement of the neck and have persisted.

We placed a magnet in the tank for a few days to mop up the residue ferros material. Have fitted a new fuel filter. Have removed the carb this weekend to clean (it was spotless) and now the engine starts fine but will not tick over!!! So will work through the vacum hoses and electrics.

So I've joined the MK1 Owners Club today to check out the events, technical forums etc. and spotted your topic. Yey!


The only way to get our Golf to fail is to push the throttle firm into the floor at 60mph+ whilst climbing a long hill so the car is under some load. The engine will eventually fail (also failed on the M25 @ 80mph+). Even if you keep the throttle wide open or try to nurse it, it won't recover - nothing gives.

BUT!

If you turn the ignision off for a few moments (and bump or re-start on the move) - sometimes a few minutes, it will be fine. So the search continues.  Thanks to all you guys for the points mentioned and the notes on faulty carbs.

The search continues  :dontknow:

Thanks for the reply WestEndGirl.  It is encouraging to know that there are fellow members out there with the same problem.

Paul_C: I've checked my fuel filler neck - it's a bit rusty, but not falling apart…yet! :-)  I'll order a replacement filler neck, but more worryingly, it didn't seem to solve WestEndGirl's problem.

I think I'll go one further and replace the tank as well as the tank residue issue mentioned above is something I'd like to avoid.

I'd like to believe this issue can be solved!  :dontknow:

Phil

how strange…….. ive had my first mk1 golf (rivage) about 3 weeks now and in the last few days ive been suffering these problems.
Engine died a couple of times while driving and now i'm struggling to start it.  she seems to start eventually.
i dont know but have a feeling its contamination in the fuel as my fuel neck is quite rusty.
oh the joys!!!!!!!

Interesting…

i-craig has a Rivage (nice!) which means fuel injection.  WestEndGirl and I have Clippers e.g. carburettors fitted.

However, we are all experiencing similiar symptoms, which means paul_c's suggestion of fuel contamination as a result of rusty fuel filler neck is the common factor here.

Found some info on how to extract the rust particles from the fule tank here:

http://www.vwgolfmk1.o…ms&file=viewtopic&t=44981

Also - instructions for replacing the fuel filler neck is on the left, but here's a link:

http://www.vwgolfmk1.o…ontent&pa=showpage&pid=43

Been thinking of replacing my fuel tank as a precaution when I'm doing my fuel filler neck - any other bits I need to order/replace at the same time?

Does Crazy Quiff still do stainless filler necks - can't spot them on his website anymore?

Thanks for everyone's help and all the comments to date!

Phil

Just spotted this thread  - similiar symptoms - mentions replacing the fuel sender in the tank…

http://www.vwgolfmk1.o…viewtopic&p=667706#667706

Phil

Hi, i have a 89 1.8 carb Clipper and have experienced the same problems as you guys last year (all sorted now, touch serious ammounts of wood). I replaced fuel filler which was totally rotten, cleaned out tank, replaced under bonnet fuel filter 3 times (i found the filter type which has a fine  mesh cage inside the housing better than the standard type which lets crap through), and i replaced the vapour seperator too, the v/s acts as a fuel resevoir before the carb but also holds copius amounts of crap too (also they rot away inside over time which in turn feeds rot to the carb). Runs fine now!!! Praise the lord for the RAC.

Thanks 89Clipper.  Hard to believe, but this is good news - it means there is a potential solution available. :-)

Thanks for letting us know about the vapour seperator.

To summarise, the bits needed for this job:

* New fuel filler neck
* New tank (optional) - if not replacing, you need to clean it out.
* New fuel sender unit - fits in tank
* New vapour seperator
* New fuel filter

I'll try to dig the part numbers out and post them on here.

Phil

Hi, i think you could get away without replacing the fuel sender, i pulled mine out and flushed it through and checked the condition of the filter on it which in my case didn't exist as it had been removed, i used an old pair of tights (not mine) and made my own filter as i didn't know i could replace but have found out since they can be got from Big Boys Toys for about £3. The vapour seperator i got from ebay, here is the link http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VW-GOLF-2-JETTA-SCIROCCO-A80-FUEL-VAPOUR-SEPARATOR-/170544516512?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item27b53ecda0 .

I'm getting the ump now………………
took my golf out this morning. took a couple of turns to start but i can handle that!
went for a drive 30 mins or so without stoping. no probs, ran really sweet including 60-70 mph down the bypass.
got home and thaught I'd give her a clean. went to start her up and move her out of the sun……….
and what do you know, she wont start!!!!!!!!!!!!

I disconnected the fuel pipe as it comes out of the fuel filter and turned the ignition, ran some fuel into a pot. It certainly flowed well and looked clean.
I dont understand why when she does start she runs like a dream. surely if it was starvation or contamination she'd run a bit lumpy?!?!?!?!?!?

horrible to ay but as above am please its not just me having this problem
i will try some of the above notes

i have the prob of running and then stopping the car going to move it and it wont start
leave 10 mins come back starts not prob

but worse i have the old cutting out trick!

i live in bristol and drove to my girlfriends uni in cheltenham, fine all the way there 65 - 75 mph, just get to the chelt junction and i loose all power will just tick over - every time i rev i get less back untill it wont run at all - leave the car 30 mins will staret and off i go again no worries. thought it was a one off.
 on the way home exact same thing get to the avonmount bridge and i start loosing my power until the car wont run.

but a few months before drove it to saltash got there in one go!

Hi, mine ran or didn't as the case was as veedubjay's, it would tick over all day long but as soon as you put foot on gas it would die. crap in fuel system, clean it all and replace what you can with new. Filler neck, filter, clean tank, replace vapour seperator etc………..

Right, time for an update:

Finally got my cabby back from the garage last night - looks like everyone's advice was spot on.  Rusty fuel filler caused muck to fall into tank and contaminated just about everything else.

My trusty mechanic, Joe, did the following:

• - removed the tank;[/list:u]
  
  • - replaced the filler neck;[/list:u]
    
    • - I also supplied a new filler cap - fitted;[/list:u]
      
      • - Fitted a new fuel vapour seperator;[/list:u]
        
        • - Removed the carb and cleaned it out - lots of muck in it, even though it was rebuilt 2 years ago;[/list:u]
          
          • - used 3 x fuel filters to clean up all the muck from the tank;[/list:u]
            
            I asked Joe to service and MOT it at the same time - came back woth no advisories! Well chuffed.
            
            Last night took the car out for a short drive and it was a bit erratic. Settled after about 5 mins. Took it out this morning for a 30 mile run and it's now running fine.
            
            I'm still not 100% happy with my Pierburg carb…but that's another story.
            
            Thanks for everyone's help - much appreciated. Roll on summer…. :-)
            
            Phil