Loose steering
Posted
#1625427
(In Topic #222849)
Old Timer
The steering has a fair bit of play which can be scary under heavy breaking. The previous owner thought it was the steering rack. I also noticed a mechanic's note in the service history mentioning the engine mounts were loose. They gave it a good look over and two test drives. They checked engines mounts, brakes, rack, suspension, bushings etc. They basically said there is nothing wrong with it. I guess that is good news. They did say the rack was a bit loose, and that I needed to get the tracking done. They didn't do it there.
I went to get the tracking done. They had trouble removing a bolt so couldn't do it completely (still charged me £72 though). Hopefully I'll get a discount on another go when I get the bolt cracked. He went for a test drive and said it was better, but it felt like it was dragging as if it needed power steering. He though the original wheels would have been smaller (I have the Le Castelles that it comes with). Though slightly better, it still feel uncomfortable to me. Should I get a new rack?
Technically, he was right; it did originally have power steering. Is the original type of PAS any good, or is it better to go for electric?
Whip
/wip/
Noun - Car
When the steering wheel was first put into use in automobiles, it was called the whip. The term has now been generalised to classify any automobile.
/wip/
Noun - Car
When the steering wheel was first put into use in automobiles, it was called the whip. The term has now been generalised to classify any automobile.
Posted
Local Hero
Don't even try moving the steering wheel when stopped, it's very heavy and puts a lot of strain on the bulk head where the steering rack is bolted to and the bulk head can crack.. try rolling a little before turning the steering.
What tyre pressure are your tyres at?
I add a couple of PSI as that helps lighten up the steering in town.
These are not modern cars and you have to drive slightly differently, leave a little more space between you and the car in front as no ABS can be scary if you have to brake hard as the wheels lock up and you have to pump the brakes yourself to steer…
Was the £72 charge for tracking and camber angle set up?
Originally cars came with a fixed passenger side track rod so you can't adjust it only the drivers side so I hope they did not try and adjust that side….
There is no bolt to remove to set up the tracking just a nut to loosen on the track rod…
For the camber angle you need to loosen the nuts to adjust the top bolt but again no bolt to remove..
I see from one of your other post you are in Somerset, I'm about 10 miles north of Yeovil and work in Burnham-on-sea so perhaps I could have a quick look for you?
My Mk1 Golf cabriolet is a daily drive but at the moment I'm fitting new suspension, wishbones, bushes etc so it's not on the road but I'm using my Mk1 Scirocco so perhaps you could drive that to see what the steering should be like…
PM me if you wish to meet up?
1988 Mk1 Golf GTi Cabriolet 1.8cc DX, K-jet. Daily drive. 317,000 miles and counting
1978 Mk1 Scirocco GLS 1.6cc FR, Webber carb. Weekend toy.
1978 Mk1 Scirocco GLS 1.6cc FR, Webber carb. Weekend toy.
Posted
Local Hero
What makes you say "Technically, he was right; it did originally have power steering" does it have it on the boot sticker? or power steering rack and pulley still in the bay? if has been disconnected then maybe could try recommission it, but like mark says 99% OF the cars didnt come with PAS.
if steering rack is on way out you tend to find its requiring more turns than expected to reach full lock.
try getting some fresh oil/greae to the rack and behind the universal links, maybe if lack of use just got stiff.
If its tyres then your castelles wont make a difference as lots drive on them and bigger and wider. my ronals turbos are 15" and they are very heavy to steer with as they are 7" wide. my 15" bbs RA , 14 bbs RA, 15" bbs RM 010/012 feel fine. porchse teledials feel heavy at low speeds due to need of 20mm space adaptor, widening track.
marks got a few cars , ive got more than signature says and none have PAS. and they are aged 1983-1993 in case of cabby x 5,tintop and sportline.. for my t25, and 1988 for my golf gti mk2, my mk2 scirocco has no PAS,
On the drive
T25 Diesel…sameoldblueshi£ (currently under resto)
Rocco gt2….1990 secret 2…(currently under resto)
Mk4 99 1.8t indigo blue Gti with 43k miles
Caster 93 clipper JH Green cabby
Snowy 91 GTi White cabby( sat waiting for inspiration)
Myvalver 89 GTi Grey mk2 16v
Yuppy Flu 91 GTi Flash Red Sportline
Golf mk1 owner's club on Spotify
Mk1 golf owners club playlist: Golf mk1 owner's club playlist - YouTube
T25 Diesel…sameoldblueshi£ (currently under resto)
Rocco gt2….1990 secret 2…(currently under resto)
Mk4 99 1.8t indigo blue Gti with 43k miles
Caster 93 clipper JH Green cabby
Snowy 91 GTi White cabby( sat waiting for inspiration)
Myvalver 89 GTi Grey mk2 16v
Yuppy Flu 91 GTi Flash Red Sportline
Golf mk1 owner's club on Spotify
Mk1 golf owners club playlist: Golf mk1 owner's club playlist - YouTube
Posted
Local Hero
I have driven both a manual rack, and a power steering mk1.
Over here the original Golfs/Rabbits back in the early 80's had the majority of manual racks.
The Cabriolets from Karmann over here had Power Steering as they were sold geared to Women, and they had issues with parking and such that it was difficult for them to drive.
I liked the feel of my Diesel Bunny when it had wider tires than the Stock 155sr13's, and the same goes for my Cabriolets which I went to a wider tire on those.
Once either car has momentum, it was easy steering, but the manuals can be a PITA if not moving.
Rack a bit loose, could be, it needs grease, the tie-rods are worn, or the mounts are shot…. Knowing how they ment "loose" is paramount to the resolution.
Which bolt did they have issues with…. The Camber or a Tie-rod. For the Camber you have to loosen the lower bolt, then the upper and move the bolt so that the adjustment for camber can be done. I have had folks tell me that over the years until I proved them wrong.
Also some times you can get the camber set until you either push in the strut to the spindle or move it out from the spindle, as I have had to assist the folks setting the "tracking" Alignment over here….Usually only had to do it if I changed out the lower ball joints, or control arm…. If you remove the strut assembly off of the lower ball joint and take the Tie-rod out, and hang the Caliper off of the body, you can remove the "whole" strut and not effect the camber.
Lastly, the first time I tore in to any of my cars, I used Never-seize on all parts, that is the tie-rods Camber bolts threads and eccentrics, as well as the lower camber bolt and such so that I could easily remove or adjust things as required….. I think that I am working on my 3rd bottle (1lb) of never-seize since about 1981….Gotta love that stuff, makes tear down or re-assembly so much more enjoyable.
What do Divorces, Great Coffee, and Car Electrics all have in common?
They all start with GOOD Grounds.
Where are my DIY Links?
They all start with GOOD Grounds.
Where are my DIY Links?
Posted
Old Timer
I always keep the car moving when I steer, even with modern cars. I must have learnt to drive before PAS. Good to know steering while still is a big no no though. To my shame, I haven't checked the PSI yet. I keep forgetting.
I'm getting used to the braking (or lack thereof). I generally keep a good braking distance anyway.
I wasn't paying much attention when the tracking guy was explaining (I was late for a meeting). He may have said "nut."
This is the change…
I'll take Mark up on his offer, and take on board all the other advice.
Cheers for all the input.
Whip
/wip/
Noun - Car
When the steering wheel was first put into use in automobiles, it was called the whip. The term has now been generalised to classify any automobile.
/wip/
Noun - Car
When the steering wheel was first put into use in automobiles, it was called the whip. The term has now been generalised to classify any automobile.
Posted
Local Hero
Loose steering
If so it’d be easy enough to sort pas.
Euro and USA tended to be pulley pump driven steering set ups.
You can get an aftermarket bolt in column that’s electric powered.
Think it’s called easy steer.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
"Making Cabbies More Beautiful One Roof at a Time"
Posted
Old Timer
Whip
/wip/
Noun - Car
When the steering wheel was first put into use in automobiles, it was called the whip. The term has now been generalised to classify any automobile.
/wip/
Noun - Car
When the steering wheel was first put into use in automobiles, it was called the whip. The term has now been generalised to classify any automobile.
Posted
MOTY 2013
your front camber is all over the shop so you need that sorted, I guess that was the nut he couldn't undo. you have 2 botls either side holdign strut to bearing carrier, get them cracked off and ask for a reset
at the back rear wheel toe is out as well which could be bent stub axle or bad beam bushes I guess
Hello my name is John and I'm a dub addict.
My wiring diagrams and other documents have moved here:
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My wiring diagrams and other documents have moved here:
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Posted
Local Hero
1988 Mk1 Golf GTi Cabriolet 1.8cc DX, K-jet. Daily drive. 317,000 miles and counting
1978 Mk1 Scirocco GLS 1.6cc FR, Webber carb. Weekend toy.
1978 Mk1 Scirocco GLS 1.6cc FR, Webber carb. Weekend toy.
Posted
MOTY 2013
Hello my name is John and I'm a dub addict.
My wiring diagrams and other documents have moved here:
VAG Documents & Downloads
You'll need to sign into google/gmail for the link to work! (its free!)
My wiring diagrams and other documents have moved here:
VAG Documents & Downloads
You'll need to sign into google/gmail for the link to work! (its free!)
Posted
Local Hero
I'm hopefully going to have a look over The_whips car next weekend to see what may be wrong.
I've never had one of those fancy tracking alignment set up just the basic 4 wheel tracking test as I do the camber my self.
I'll check condition of wishbones and bushes as well as top mounts, rack mounts etc…
1988 Mk1 Golf GTi Cabriolet 1.8cc DX, K-jet. Daily drive. 317,000 miles and counting
1978 Mk1 Scirocco GLS 1.6cc FR, Webber carb. Weekend toy.
1978 Mk1 Scirocco GLS 1.6cc FR, Webber carb. Weekend toy.
Posted
MOTY 2013
Hello my name is John and I'm a dub addict.
My wiring diagrams and other documents have moved here:
VAG Documents & Downloads
You'll need to sign into google/gmail for the link to work! (its free!)
My wiring diagrams and other documents have moved here:
VAG Documents & Downloads
You'll need to sign into google/gmail for the link to work! (its free!)
Posted
Old Timer
Cheers guys.
Whip
/wip/
Noun - Car
When the steering wheel was first put into use in automobiles, it was called the whip. The term has now been generalised to classify any automobile.
/wip/
Noun - Car
When the steering wheel was first put into use in automobiles, it was called the whip. The term has now been generalised to classify any automobile.
Posted
Local Hero
the_whip said
It's great to have people who know what they are taking about, rather than mechanics who just say "There's nothing wrong with it."
Cheers guys.
The only Mechanic that I totally trust is myself…and sometimes I wonder about that….
Caster if off has always been a bent control arm on my cars because of children curbing the car….
Be warned that I have had 2 "kits" ordered from places that were bent You couldn't see it, but if it doesn't bolt up in about 15 minutes then suspect the new part as being off….
If the car was wrecked then you could have a bent frame that is throwing the caster off.
One quick way to gauge caster is to measure the wheel to the wing edges… if moved to the rear or the front as the wheel doesn't look centered, then you have a bent control arm.
On the inner tracking rods, you can use the adjustable left one on the right side that is get 2 lefts and put them left and right, then add new outer rod ends. way easier to fine tune the adjustment.
I use a Magnetic angle gauge on the rotor to set the camber…If I should change it… and checking it is nice to…..
If I am going to be lazy and change a strut cartridge by breaking the Camber bolts I first replace the lug bolts in to the rotors and tighten them up to hold the disk in place. I then use my gauge to measure the camber…and write it in sharpie on the disk so I don't forget.
I have had alignment shops over here tell me that camber isn't adjustable… so I take it to another shop.
I have a pretty good place now, but when a new manager was moved in, he swore up and down to me that the camber wasn't adjustable…. I had to explain it in 2 year old terms to get him to understand….
What do Divorces, Great Coffee, and Car Electrics all have in common?
They all start with GOOD Grounds.
Where are my DIY Links?
They all start with GOOD Grounds.
Where are my DIY Links?
Posted
Old Timer
Briano1234 said
Caster if off has always been a bent control arm on my cars because of children curbing the car….
As my children are 9 and 7, reading that makes me shiver with horror. The thought of letting a 9 year old near my car!
I'm assuming that yours are obviously older…but possibly no wiser : )
Posted
Local Hero
paceman said
Briano1234 said
Caster if off has always been a bent control arm on my cars because of children curbing the car….
As my children are 9 and 7, reading that makes me shiver with horror. The thought of letting a 9 year old near my car!
I'm assuming that yours are obviously older…but possibly no wiser : )
Sometimes I wonder if they ever have growed up…….Just saying…
At Nine Years old, I was already able to change a tire, and or plugs/rotor/condenser…. by 13, I could do body work, as well as tear a car down to get it ready for a rebuild brake/suspension work as well…… My father was the type of folks that if it is broke fix it, if it breaks again fix it better… (He grew up in the US depression.) So just saying start them off early.
What do Divorces, Great Coffee, and Car Electrics all have in common?
They all start with GOOD Grounds.
Where are my DIY Links?
They all start with GOOD Grounds.
Where are my DIY Links?
Posted
Old Timer
I reckon my 7 yr old lad will be the same, but my 9 old Daughter will probably just resort to 'Daddy, it's broken!'
…And I'll come running….unfortunately!
Posted
Old Timer
The front shocks don't match, the wrong bump stops have been fitted, there is play in the rack, one of the wishbones is after-market and doesn't quite fit, and the steering has more turns in one direction than the other. The garages didn't seem to spot any of this.
I'm going to attempt most of the work myself. Not the rack as everyone says what a pain it is.
Whip
/wip/
Noun - Car
When the steering wheel was first put into use in automobiles, it was called the whip. The term has now been generalised to classify any automobile.
/wip/
Noun - Car
When the steering wheel was first put into use in automobiles, it was called the whip. The term has now been generalised to classify any automobile.
Posted
Local Hero
Plenty to keep you busy and if you forget anything I said let me know, fingers crossed I can remember everything….
Mk1's are good cars to work on as long you can undo the bolts and nuts and most of the time you can use basic tools to get things fixed.
Alot has been done with your car and some nice touches and I enjoyed the spin around the block, been a few months since I've been in my Mk1 Golf and has given the push to complete my suspension swap and re-bushing the front end.
1988 Mk1 Golf GTi Cabriolet 1.8cc DX, K-jet. Daily drive. 317,000 miles and counting
1978 Mk1 Scirocco GLS 1.6cc FR, Webber carb. Weekend toy.
1978 Mk1 Scirocco GLS 1.6cc FR, Webber carb. Weekend toy.
Posted
MOTY 2013
while everything else is off its just 4 nuts on the bulkhead and a bolt thru the universal joint you have to remove then you can slide it out the passenger side
may help to take one or both of the track rods off but tbh you'll probably have plenty of room
Hello my name is John and I'm a dub addict.
My wiring diagrams and other documents have moved here:
VAG Documents & Downloads
You'll need to sign into google/gmail for the link to work! (its free!)
My wiring diagrams and other documents have moved here:
VAG Documents & Downloads
You'll need to sign into google/gmail for the link to work! (its free!)
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