A522 ESS - category B write off? Advice please

Hi all. Does anyone know whether the following problem is solvable, or am I just destined to sell off my restored helios blue campaign for parts?!

Background – I purchased the car in early 2010 and collected it on a trailer from Inverness. Admittedly I didn’t complete a vehicle check but when I got home I sent off the V5 to the DVLA, taxed and insured the car, and then got some initial repairs and an MOT done.

I decided to go the whole hog and asked my garage to restore it to former glories (after a brief wobble where I nearly sol it on ebay) – and by Christmas 2012 it was ready (see below for everything done).

I then found out the car has been marked on an insurance database as a category B write off in 1997 when I tried to insure again with Footman James (through Chaucer Insurance).

I’ve spoken to the DVLA who state they have not got it recorded as a cat b – if they did they’ve said that I might to be able to get a VOSA VIC given it’s such an old ‘write-off’.

I’ve spoken again to Footman James who have no other info except that Chaucer told them the car was marked as a write-off, and I’ll see what I can get out of Chaucer tomorrow.cf_emoticons__BangHead:I’ve also checked on the Motor Insurance Database/MID (doesn’t give that type of info), and spoken to the Motor Insurance Anti Fraud and Theft Register /MIAFTR who said to speak to the insurer that wrote the car off.

Does anyone know how to find out which insurer wrote the car off? Or have any other bright ideas?

For completeness here is all the work completed – seems a shame to throw it away!

Body work repaired, rust removed and repaired, full glass out respray, new front panel complete and new front wings.
Rear sub frame anchorage point remade and welded, underneath repaired, welded and waxoyled. Gearbox reconditioned and refitted with new clutch.
Engine rebuilt, new piston rings, big end bearings and oil pump, valves reground with new stem seals fitted, all new oil seals fitted. New timing belt, tensioner and water pump fitted.
All new suspension including shockers and springs all round, new front lower arms, new wheel bearings front and rear, new top shocker mounts. New brakes, front discs, pads, calipers and flexes, rear shoes ,cylinders, flexes and drums plus all new metal pipes. New exhaust from downpipe.
New interior head lining.

FYI, the category system is a voluntary code of practice between various salvage companies and insurance companies and not a legal requirement.

im pretty sure if it was a cat B it should have been only sold to a registered breaker and broken up for parts, if its cat c or d it can be put back on road fairly easily, you shouldnt have been able to buy a cat b,

when you mention the work you have put in was the bodywork done because of crash damage or rust? if because of damage the reason that the car would have been cat b would have been that it was too badly damaged to go back on the road unlike cat c and d which are just uneconomical to repair.

i think if it was a damaged cat b you may be knackered, your only hope is try to plead your case, but it may cost for engineers reports and pretty sure if you can put it back on the road it will be on a Q plate

How about replace the "missing" scuttle panel because "The previous owner attempted a smoothed bay look" using a second hand one which will happen to have another chassis number stamped into it. Just make sure you get the V5 with the replacement scuttle panel

joeb-w said

Hi all. Does anyone know whether the following problem is solvable, or am I just destined to sell off my restored helios blue campaign for parts?!

Background – I purchased the car in early 2010 and collected it on a trailer from Inverness. Admittedly I didn’t complete a vehicle check but when I got home I sent off the V5 to the DVLA, …………………

Buyer doesn't send the V5 off…..the seller does. Anyway….did you see it, and did it say the car was a write off (there's some kind of wording on the V5 if this is the case, which remains on there even if the car is subsequently VIC checked and returned to the road.

AFAIK a Cat B write off means that DVLA won't re-issue a V5 in another person's name. So, did you get a V5 in your own name?

AFAIK you can't tax a car unless you're the registered keeper, though if you're the new owner you can go to the post office with the small green tear off bit (V5/2?) and get it taxed that way. If you're not the registered keeper on the V5 (which you won't be, if DVLA didn't issue another….) you aren't the one liable for the tax or SORN.

Sounds like a right muddle.

Unsure how you got it registered in your name, taxed, MoT'd and insured initially.

If its on the insurance database as Cat B, as long as no error has been made then thats gona be your biggest issue.

Technically my understanding is bar replacing the missing scuttle / identity panel, the car shouldnt have been allowed back on the road, and should have been broken for parts :-(

If you can work your way around it and get it Q plates and then vic checked thats probably your best best, there is some reading here on category damaged cars etc

best of luck with it mate, Rich

Category A, B, C and D write offs. Whats are they? - Page 1 - General Gassing [Archive] - PistonHeads UK

Thanks for all the responses.

I do agree that the car 'should' have been broken for parts but I understand it's not necessarily a legal requirement (or wasn't back in 1997).

I've found out that according to the register the car was written off on 14/3/1997 by Provident insurance. I've spoken to Provident insurance - but they won't tell me anything (won't even confirm they've written the car off) unless I can give them personal data of the owner back in 1997 - damned data protection! So i  can't find out if the cat b status is in error….

I do have a v5 in my name for it, received from the DVLA after I bought the car (and then taxed, MOT'd, insured etc). And it doesn't have anything at all on it about being a write-off (which I understand appears in the comments section). I've spoken to the DVLA again today and they've confirmed again that they have no record whatsover of it being a write-off - so the insurer has never informed them. And I can't arrange a VIC (to check the identity) unless the DVLA have been informed it's a write off.

Will look into the process to get the equivalent of a q-plate, but no idea how it works.

Btw when I bought the car it didn't look like it had been in a crash at all - drove in a straight line! Was just fuill of rust - hence the bodywork repairs to cut out the rust and respray…

You're write that it's a volunatry code - apparantly if I can get the car insured then I can use it again, and apparanlty there are insurers out there who will insure cat b's but i'm yet to find one! Next on the list is Adrian Flux.

Thanks again!

Not sure Provident can hide behind the DPA.
I mean it's not possible for you to know the owner back then. If they have the details then surely they know what's contained in the file.

Section 35 of the DPA.
 
Disclosures required by law or made in connection with legal proceedings etc.

(1)Personal data are exempt from the non-disclosure provisions where the disclosure is required by or under any enactment, by any rule of law or by the order of a court.

(2)Personal data are exempt from the non-disclosure provisions where the disclosure is necessary–
(a)for the purpose of, or in connection with, any legal proceedings (including prospective legal proceedings), or
(b)for the purpose of obtaining legal advice,
or is otherwise necessary for the purposes of establishing, exercising or defending legal rights.

So if you need legal advice or the seller has sold you a ringer that's a crime. So I would go back to Provident and explain section 35 to them.
I have used this a couple of times.
If you believe that the case has legal merit, then if they still say no, you can state that you will seek a hearing before the a Judge to enforce the request and that any costs involved will be expected to be met by them.

what I am suggesting is that they hold the personal information on the owner of the car too. Which would be linked to any claim or pay out for the car.

With these 2 bits of info:

1. the car seemingly not been involved in a serious accident, from its condition
2. the insurance company placing it onto a 'write off' register as a Cat B but not informing DVLA of it

I'd say that the original insurer, Provident, made an admin error and it shouldn't even be on that register they have.

If you have no joy with Provident, then you could try FSA which regulates insurance companies. But you'd need to go through the process with Provident until you reach a dead end.