Mk1 cabby steering problem

Hi, this is my first post so hello everyone. looking for a bit of advice. Bought a mk1 cabby RHD(everything standard) and there is something off with steering. When I lock the steering over as if to turn left the nearside wheel has too much lock(almost sideways) and tyre is rubbing on inner arch. I have centred the rack, adjusted tie rods to 69mm making sure to measure from the recess on offside. Fixed tie rod measures 379 mm on nearside and I adjusted offside to the same and set the tracking. The rack mounts seem fine. Thought a control arm was bent so changed them for new. Camber set, tracking set again and it’s still the same. It’s seems like the tie rod is to short, but I know it isn’t. I’m pulling my hair out with it now and starting to think the chassis is bent. Any advice would be appreciated guys.

Got a picture of the steering rack, tie rods etc?

Do you have power steering fitted?

How did you centralize the rack?

More questions as well, is the drivers side rod a two Piece or a one Piece rod.

Adjusting the camber, did you adjust it in the air or on the ground as there is a big difference.

Control arms effect the Caster which is unadjustable save for swapping them out.

Which is why I usually opt for changing bits and pieces out on the car, then taking it to an alignment shop to have it adjusted by a machine…So I know that it is right.

Now with the Cabriolet, you can use two piece rods for the left and right so you have an inner, and an outer tie rod and make adjusting it so much easier.  I know as I have done it.  I also coat the tie-rods with Never-seize as I have had to fight the OEM rods off the car to remove them.  

So as I said more questions…OH, and are you running OEM tires as well or did you change them for a different size as 14" normal to 15…

Hi mark thanks for the reply. Not in at the moment, I'll try to take photos later. It's a manual rack. Centralised it by taking tie rods off and measuring equal distance either end(from recess on drivers side). Put tie rods back on with measurement of 69mm from where I measured when centralising to the stepped lip on the knuckle if that makes sense.Tie rods set 379mm from that step to centre of tie rod end. Cheers Steve.

Hi Briano it has fixed tie rod on passenger side and adjustable on drivers side. Camber set on level ground. It has 15 inch g60 steels on at the moment with 185/55/15 tyres but is exactly the same with the 14 inch le castelette 185/60/14 tyres on.

See over here on this side of the pond, the single piece rod assembly was always on the right side of the car.

But the latter Cabriolets had two piece rods attached, or at least mine did.  The 2-piece are easier to adjust, and replace as the outers are more often than not what goes bad.

The way that I adjust the inners on replacement is to measure the rod length, first on both new and old.

One Piece I usually measure the length as from the end of the rod (inner) to the center line of the outer.  I have found some off as much as a half an inch which makes adjusting them wonky if not caught. I also measure the inside of the inner to a fixed point on the rack. I write everything down.

For the Two Piece, if I am replacing the outer, I wrap White PTFE (Teflon) Tape to the threads behind the inner so I can get the inner back to the same starting point. I then measure from the edge of the inner closest to the rack, to the center line of the outer rod. prior to removing.

I return all the new parts to the same measurements.

Knowing where you start from it is easier to return it to the same value as not all makers of parts have the same values as OEM parts as in length totals or the inner depth of thread…

Now Setting the camber on the ground is way different than setting it in the air, and you can be off as much as 4 to 5 degrees…. with the parts in the air suspended by the strut, you get the mount adding to your woes as the shock tends to swing in as the weight of the car is off the tire.

This is why when I do it I use a magnetic Angle finder on the wheel prior to jacking, and then on the rotor as it is up in the air.

I have seen the Steering knuckle mount to the strut tube have as much as a quarter of an inch play in it, so I tend to mark the Knuckle with Paint or a Scratch outline where the two meet prior to removing the strut or knuckle off the car so I can return it to the same value.

Placing new parts can disturb the ones that you didn't change as in strut mounts as well.

As many things I measure, I always take my car to the alignment shop…afterwards when time allows…. why
because of things like you are having right now.

When I do go to the alignment shop, I am usually not off by much, and with the amount of never-seize that I use they are really easy for the mech to adjust.

Oh, I have caught many alignment gents over the years trying to use a impact wrench to adjust the camber with out having to loosen the other bolt so they get a false reading…. Just a heads up…. I know the Bentley and the Haynes make it look so easy……NOT. IF they tell you the Camber is out, loosen Both strut/spindle bolts and move the assembly pushing in or out on the tire you can get it in alignment, and a lot of that is because they didn't loosen both bolts.

One of the niftiest tools I have purchased was a Tie-rod Outer removal tool for my pneumatic compressor.. it really removes those stubborn ones… But after I have replaced and using the Never-Seize I rarely have to resort to that tool…It is usually used on new to me cars that were never removed by me.

Which I wonder if the one-piece rod that you replaced was on the wrong side to begin with.

Thanks for the reply briano, I have both the Bentley and haynes manuals and used these to set the steering up. I understand changing the tie rod to an adjustable one will make it easier to adjust but there seems more going on. When the wheels are straight ahead they are parallel but when I lock all the way to the left the passenger side wheel(drivers side where you are) turns more than the other side so they are not parallel.
Ps thanks for the tips

If you lift the front of car to save your arms… How many turns of the steering wheel from center to each lock and are they the same each way?

Strange problem you have and not heard of it before, post up some pictures when you get a chance and we can see if anything does not look right??


 

Hey guys just got in and it started peeing it down so took some quick pics sorry about quality.

I know the cars on stands and this affects things but if you look at the last 2 pics you can see how much closer the passenger wheel is compared to drivers side. It's like this on the ground but not as bad.

Hi mark,  from the centre position it's just shy of 2 turns left and 2 turn right about 3 3/4 lock to lock.

It seems adjustment makes not difference. On the fix tie rod side it's always going to stop when the knuckle hits the end of the rack. It's as if the tie rod needs to be longer but it's the correct length. I know an adjustable one may sort the issue but just concerned why the standard one is causing this issue.

As I stated over here the one-piece rods were always installed on the right side of the Car, your drivers side.
The Adjustable was on the tranny side.

I have never seen it reversed as you are showing.
For what it is worth.  

Manual:
The adjustable inner rod is pn 171419804
The outer tie-rod pn 171419812

Power:
The adjustable inner rod is pn 155422803
The outer tie-rod pn 171419812

Briano you maybe right and it may be worth reversing them but in my Bentley manual it states "all replacement tie rods are adjustable. When replacing a non adjustable left side tie rod, the new adjustable tie rod must be adjusted to standard length. I don't know I'm confused now lol.