cars with neagative HPI history/write offs-effect on value?

Hi all,

i wont be too specific to be fair to the seller but i need advice on this badly-i've been seriously looking for a MK1's recently. came very close to buying what appeared to be a fantastic example series 2 GTI, it really ticked all the boxes with a lot of work done and the price was reasonable (though at the TOP of my budjet)

the HPI check turned up:

- that the colour had been changed 5 years from new from blue to it's currnet -also standard- GTI colour (hpi shows it's allways been a GTI)

-the car was the' subject of an insurance total losspayment' in 1995

i have serveral issues i'd apprerciate some advice on:

-it seem's a strange move to change the colour of a 5 year old car? any opinions on why this might happen?!?

-how does the fact that the car has been a write off affect it's value to me and also it's re-sale value?

-am i right in thinking that as long as i get an engineers report and i't all checked out that it doesn't make much difference?!? (this is my currnet thinking but i don't want to pay over the odd's and loose a ton of money when i want to get rid!)

please help one confused newbie!

ta

The write off will mean it COULD (probably will) be hard to sell on for it's genuine market value. As for the current value it will certainly detract from it. How much is hard to say.

It's really down to you and whether you are prepared to take the risk that it may be hard to sell on. If the car has been repaired properly, is straight and in good condition then I would say go for it - but beat that price down as much as possible. I would say 20-25% at least…

As for the colour change, no idea. Perhaps someone threw nitomors over it :dontknow:

If the car has been the subject of a total loss payment you need to know whether it was a category A,B,C, or D write-off.

My daily (pug) is a Cat C, which means uneconomical to repair, but it can be put back on the road. I'm fairly sure Cat D is ok to put back on the road too.

I think Cat A is damaged beyond repair, and B is permanently scrapped, so if your car falls into either category then it can't be put back on the road.

I would suspect that the colour change followed an accident, and total respray would indicate some fairly serious damage, although it's very hard to say for sure.

Is there something special about this car which makes risking this worthwhile? If I were you I'd consider not buying it at all…

Rich

Cat A means "must be scrapped - do not sell as parts".
Cat B means "must not return to the road, but may be stripped for parts"
Cat C means "cost of repair exceeds market value"
Cat D means "cost of repair less than market value, but insurer has chosen to write off for other reasons".

Normally Cat D is used when the car is awkward to obtain parts for - eg an older car, for example a bumper & front panel on a car worth ?800. Cat A is used for burnt out cars. What happens is at high temperatures, the plastic used on wiring partially burns and chemically changes to a toxic substance, and it smokes and coats other parts which means they are hazardous to touch, etc. Walt would probably be able to fill you in on the details!

Cat D : Tends to be where the repair costs of the vehicle has gone over the threshold of what the insurer repairs upto but still under the value of the vehicle. Most insurers will only repair upto a set percentage of the value of the car.

I have bought loads of Cat C and Cat D write offs to repair and then sell on and the fact they have previously been written off definatly reduces there sell on value. Personally i see and estimate damage repairs on loads of cars everyday,  but i still would not buy a car that had been wrote off and i could not see the damage as to why.

If you buy this car, i would definatly be wanting money off what he is asking for it, i guess he was counting on the buyer to not hpi check it, as you would be surprised the amount that don`t.

As for buying it and getting an engineers report, that will do nothing really apart from telling you what repairs were done and to what standard. They would not tell you if the chassis was out of allign or anything like that. And the car would still be down as a write off even after the report.

Sorry to babble on mate

Hope this helps you

If you ask me, which not many people do, I would buy on condition mainly.

That is, is it safe and is it what you are looking for?

Granted the fact it's a write off will complicate things like whether it should have been put back on the road and whether it's safe.
I've never looked into it but could you find out from the DVLA or someone whether the car is on the road when it should have been stripped or even scrapped? And could you get a professional vehcle report as to how safe it is?

There is a lot of supposition and guessing here but some people buy their cars to be the most original, the best condition, the most rare, a decent runner, something cheap, something to fix…………

The question is if you know it's safe, do you want it?

Plus if these issues detract from it's resale value, you may get more motor for your money. :wink:

There's a lot of 'straight' motors out there, save your money and go for one thats not been involved in any previous insurance dealings. At the end of the day your dealing with a product thats been damaged and unless its been put back together correctly ie welded, painted, sealed etc then you will only loose out in the long run. Remember it's been recorded as 'accident damaged'. try trading that one on and you'll get a nasty shock.

cheers guys..some very considered stuff there…much appreciated.

just to clear some stuff up:

i've been told by the guy who got the check done for me (a trader) that cars of that age don't get classified type c/d or whatever all i've got is:

Recorded against: VRM
recorded on : vehicle has been the subject of and insurance total loss payment
Date: 1995

any ideas of the value of the car back in 95 (first reg early eighties)?
if the value's only a couple of grand then at best it may of just had a bad scrape/bump at worst it couls have been rolled and how you say : 'bent as a nine bob note'

since it wasn't declared that the car had been a write off in the add…whats a fair reduction on price in light of this new info?

people have suggested 2/3rds price of similar car with no negative history. i thought the car was a fraction overpriced anyway and could see myself loosing money when i come to re-sell if i dont get some seious money off which is a shame becuse the car is a BEAST…ticks all the boxes and if looks and spec is anything to go by it think the repairs will have been done properly . i could see someone else buying this car not knowing it's history so i don't think the owner will come down on price.

thinking (sadly) that unless get 25-30 percent of the asking price i'l save myself the worry and leave it.  

sue something else will come up.

thanks again for the help.

Rick.

Hi all,

i've been on the phone the the dvla today trying to find out what catagory write off it's been…apparently the dvla  don't catagorize write off's- it's the insurer. so i'm going to try to get some ino from a central insruance database tommorow.

i'm thinking:

if i get the car checked out by independent engineer and there are no problems with the chasis i'l put an offer. this offer will be 30 percent under the original asking price (which seems to be a general concensus and compensates for the unknown and lessen the chances of me loosing out when it's time to sell?!).if this offer doesn't do the trick i'l give it a miss and jsut wait for something else to turn up.

anyone know a good independent engineer in london area?

thanks again!

Rick

If the car is a "goodun" and its what you want, then i would buy it, cat C and D as said are just insurance companys values and if they deem it uneconomical to repeir it gets the status attached to the log book.
My sportline was cat D`d due to a very very light front end ding, it only needed a new clipper bumper, a grille, a bonnet and fitting up and painting! costs around ?1200, it didnt even damage the front panel which is still the original and totally un-marked, it was VIC tested in january 2006 and was deemed A1 by the tester, this test is also recorded on its log book
as said due to the cost of the parts and labour and its age (in 2005) it was cat D`d, it dont make it a bad car and anyone looking at it would never know any different, its just insurance companys seing it as "an old car" and its market value, to them its just metal and wheels and has a set insured worth value.
not blowing its own trumpet but mine is one of the best cabrios i have ever seen, it really is spotless even underneath and drives superb, its all "original" and despite its "tag" there is nothing at all wrong with it whatsoever
I got it cheaper due to its history but i wasnt put off as i have had others that have been in little dings and had the same D status if its been repaired properly then who cares? when i worked at vw even brand new cars from Wolfsburg arrived with wings and doors and body damage! caused by shipping or delivery drivers, they just replace panels and say nothing, just because its a new car and its "value" is higher.
i didnt buy mine to make a fortune, i bought it because i have always wanted a Sportline, and to drive and enjoy it in the summer or whenever 8) if i ever sell it??? i would never hide this fact and it would obviously reflect in the price, but its just a good a car as any other i have seen