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Unknown Relays & No Power

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Checking over wiring before starting her up for the first time in years & after a 1.8t conversion. Battery is new & checked it's good with multimeter. Earths from battery & gearbox to chassis are new cables to fresh metal. Yet after connecting the battery I have absolutely no power, no lights, nothing at all, not even the obligatory little spark when connecting the battery up.

1987 Cabriolet (was carb)

Checked alternator wiring. New starter fitted & checked wiring. Only thing strange I can see is the previous owner has put in 53 & 644 relays in the fusebox bottom left? I have checked the fusebox faq & they look odd there. Anyone have any ideas on the relays or what I can check next please?

golf mk1 fusebox.jpg



Last edit: by Cushti

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Has the battery been moved to the boot or is it still in the original place?

Do you have any dash lights when you turn the ignition key?


1988 Mk1 Golf GTi Cabriolet 1.8cc DX, K-jet. Daily drive. 317,000 miles and counting
1978 Mk1 Scirocco GLS 1.6cc FR, Webber carb. Weekend toy.

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Yes, battery relocated to boot. Fused & nice new thick cable running direct to starter (have bypassed fuse to check that but same problem).
No dash lights, no power, no spark, absolutely nada 

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Is there a good earth between the battery and the frame?  The Bumper bolts make good earthing points.
Then do you have a earthing cable from the frame horn to the engine?
 

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slot 7 is only needed for front fogs, and only then if the fog light power grey/yellow jumper wire has been moved from M plug to the spare grey/yellow hanging out the fusebox. (in short, 53 relay in there is fine regardless)

644 relay is newest version of 17/18 X relay so that is also ok

check spade P on rear of fusebox that should have 1 thick red from battery and another to ignition switch. look on plug D, the brown wire with spade out the back needs to go on the white 4 way spade block, which hangs off the thick brown wire from the battery negative. the spade block also has a brown wire with spade out the back which needs to go to the earth claw above fusebox

Hello my name is John and I'm a dub addict.



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Just got back from hols so sorry for late replies:

I have fitted two new thick earth cables, one from suspension turret to 02j gearbox & one from battery to frame (scrapped off paint & keyed up to fresh metal)

P block has a thick red cable going to ignition & another to the alternator (not the battery)

D plug: two brown cables come out of the same D plug pin hole, no 22 I think (none have spades out the back). One brown goes directly to the earth claw, the other goes into the engine bay & bolted to a chassis rail (I imagine this did go to the battery which is now in the boot)

Some wiring is original & I suppose could have broken down inside. To act as a test it wouldn't hurt to do the following would it:
1. Another earth from engine to chassis?
2. Redirect the earth from D plug to engine bay & fit new earth directly from D plug to battery instead?
3. Red from P block direct to battery (e.g: in case the alternator is knackered perhaps)?

Last edit: by Cushti

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D/22 you should have 1 wire off to the wiper motor, the other needs a decent earth how it is should be fine, you'll just need to earth your wiper motor brown wire somewhere else, claw or white block is fine.

the battery earth should end in the white 4 way spade block I mention, this has a wire out the back which goes to the claw to give those a good earth. then in the front side you would have the D plug spade, fuel pump spade, dash spade and whatever else needs the best possible earth. everything else goes up to the claw.

1st check is do you have good battery voltage at the P spades, then check again at the red wire on ignition switch. then switch ignition on, check if you have good voltage at the black and black/yellow wires.  chase the black back to fusebox, check you still have good voltage here, along the way look out for any previous bodgery to ignition switch wiring.

to test if your engine earth and starter power is good enough jump a thick wire from the live stud on starter to the trigger spade/plug. if it cranks over nice and fast, this is all fine. if not, run a jump lead from battery earth to one of the bolts holding starter on. if it cranks over better then you need a decent earth from battery to engine bay, I've seen a few guys struggle when the battery is only earthed in the boot.

to test if your shell is earthed well enough check voltage between battery and bare metal points in various places. near battery, stud on the A pillar, engine bay where your chassis earth is etc, if you get decent battery voltage then all is well here (but starter may still not be happy with an earth thru the shell)

repeat test between 12v supply and your earth claw(s) to make sure those are also well earthed.

As you say I would suggest you run a good live and earth from the battery to the fusebox as well

Hello my name is John and I'm a dub addict.



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It's just dawned on me what the problem is. It was your earlier question Rubjonny that made me realise the answer so big thanks there. You asked if there was a wire from P block to battery & I said no to the alternator. So the battery goes to starter & alt/ignition goes to fusebox, nothing is connecting the two. I put a thick cable between starter & alternator & everything powered up, yahoo!

So I get a little nervous going to start the 31 year old cabby up for the first time in two years, having never run it before & after doing a 1.8t conversion, yikes. My god she starts up first time without hesitation & sounds awesome. Well for about a second anyway before it cuts out lol. The throttle works fine too as I can hold it down & start her up & she revs high but it still only runs for about a second as if there's a fuel cut.

It could be one of a hundred things but my main suspect is I've been sold a duff ecu which was supposed to have had the immo deleted & been remapped so will send that off somewhere to be checked. Hey ho, all part of the fun

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Good news! duff immo off woudl be my first thought as well, Chris Bellman or James E Looms are the go to guys for this kind of thing. They can do you a rev counter adaptor too if you need one

Hello my name is John and I'm a dub addict.



My wiring diagrams and other documents have moved here:

VAG Documents & Downloads

You'll need to sign into google/gmail for the link to work! (its free!)

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Second shout for Chris Bellman, The guys a genius !!
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