Mike's helios blue 2.0 16vG60
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Old Timer
New gearbox in!
I bought the car back in Feb 2012. The previous owner had picked her up as a standard car with 102k, FSH, all original interior and engine and solid underneath. A few ‘before I bought her’ pics:
Then a few subtle mods:
Zender spoiler and coilovers, 15” P Slots
Retrimmed Recaros
9A 16V engine
And a 16V G60 conversion
All in all quite OEM+. At the time I had a standard lhasa green campaign but I really wanted a blue one in better condition so I think I’d fallen in love with the car before I went to see it. I bought the car done, just ‘needing to be set up on a rolling road’ but once I took it to a rolling road at CFM engineering in Reading it wasn’t quite that straightforward.
Firstly the manifold pressure was atmospheric when running, so there was something not right with the supercharger. Turns out its exit had been disconnected from the inlet manifold and tucked underneath so it was making all the right noises but was in fact running as a 16v with a large intercooler flow restrictor. So the charger was rebuilt.
The 16v install had been done pretty nicely but the G60 conversion was a bit of a bodge really.
The serpentine belt looked OK but was a bit flappy and it turned out the tensioner was mounted on the car rather than the engine, so it lost tension under load, so all of that had to be redone. The crank pulley was spaced out with washers rather than being spaced properly or turned down from a bigger one, so that was sorted properly too. Some Bartek brackets were used in the end and the main tensioner was actually made up specially as a bit of a hybrid of different designs.
Then once it was all back together the stacked head gaskets blew on pretty much the first power run, so out came the engine for a complete rebuild with forged rods, low comp pistons, gas flowed head and microsquirt EFI
If I’d known how this was going to go I’d have taken the car home with me after the initial rolling road visit and either done the engine rebuild myself or more likely just picked up a G60 setup from the classifieds and dropped it in, but now it’s done I’m glad I stuck with it.
While the engine work was being done I had a bodyshop sort out the little bit of surface rust in front of the rear arches, remove the Zender spoiler (luckily bonded rather than bolted on) and tidy up the front panel and engine bay, respray the front wings and had a new OE (last one in the UK) bonnet from VW fitted as the old one had completely gone along the front edge.
I got the car back ‘finished’ at the end of November 2012 but haven’t got around to much until the last few weeks
Engine shot as it is now-not visibly all that different!
New tensioner arrangement
And from the front-pic doesn't really do the new paintwork justice
New KW V2s
Old and new
Didn't get a pic of the front on the car. Ah well
And some small stuff: new grille badge, new Bosch battery – blue and red looks so much better – and a new blue expansion cap!
Return to CFM yesterday for a shakedown run. All well so far, except a bit of leaning out at higher revs now the engine is run in a bit. Green top injectors next on the list.
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Rich
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Other peoples' build threads have been a proper source of inspiration and ideas. There's still a heap of stuff to do, some of it cosmetic and some mechanical. The cosmetic seems to keep getting pushed back as I really want the running gear right first.
And there's a pile of shiny stuff from the postman in the man cave ready for the next update!
Almost forgot - comedy moment at the rolling road while Rob's doing his pre-run checks.
"that's funny - I'm only getting 85% TP reading at full throttle. Oh - here you go" (pulls mat out from under the accelerator pedal and chucks it out on the floor).
It went quite a lot better on the way home!
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I remember when it was for sale and thought it was a good deal but it sounds like its a whole better car now.
What power is it making on the rollers and what injectors are you using at the moment?
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Andy
LINCOLNSHIRE REGION - https://www.facebook.com/groups/467122313360002/
1983 MK1 Golf GTI Campaign Model - Under (looooong) resto!
1962 Rover P4 80
2002 BMW 745i
2008 BMW Z4 2.5Si
LINCOLNSHIRE REGION - https://www.facebook.com/groups/467122313360002/
1983 MK1 Golf GTI Campaign Model - Under (looooong) resto!
1962 Rover P4 80
2002 BMW 745i
2008 BMW Z4 2.5Si
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MR_LONG said
What power is it making on the rollers and what injectors are you using at the moment?
We're at a bit over 200bhp at the wheels at the moment and similar lb-ft numbers. Peak torque is at 3100 rpm but the torque curve is pretty flat from 3100-4000 rpm. I'll get some plots up once the final map is done. It's enough to break traction in the dry when the torque comes in under acceleration in first
Injectors are red tops at the moment but going for green tops as they are at over 70% duty cycle at 4500 rpm WOT
On to the gearbox:
The car's running a mk3 GTI 8v 020 gearbox, which doesn't have any problems but I'd decided by the end of the year that it was going to need changing for an 02A at some point.
I started out thinking I'd go for a CBA box from a G60, with maybe a longer 1st and 2nd from a VR6 as I'd heard good things about this setup.
I had a chat with hotgolf (Mart) as he's the man for these things and he told me most things are possible in terms of swapping ratios or final drives so to have a look at ratios to work out what I wanted. At the moment the car feels a bit short-geared, spins the wheels up a bit too easily in low gears and the revs are too high at motorway speeds on my wheels (195/45R15)
So I plotted out what I have (CHE) vs CBA with VR6 1st & 2nd, which has a slightly longer 1st, but 2nd, 4th and 5th are very similar to the CHE and 3rd is actually shorter. I think Mart suggested looking at the CDA box from the mk3 16v as they are plentiful and cheap and I settled on this option, but with a VR6 final drive.
Plot with 6000rpm change point
And 5000rpm-a bit more realistic in the real world and still nicely in the torque band from 1st-2nd
Also shows if you follow the 5th gradient back that I should be sat at around 3300rpm at 70mph
Here's a pic Mart sent during the gearbox rebuild - Peloquin diff and ARP bolts just about visible
I picked the box up from Mart last weekend (absolute legend, knows all there is to know about gearbox builds. Also makes a mean cappuccino), along with lightened ABF flywheel.
Also have an 02A starter motor, SEAT cable clutch actuator, and LUK VR6 clutch to go in, so all set.
Plan is to get the box in after this month's Berks meet as I'm busy the next couple of weekends….
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tidymike said
Cheers Smudger - yours will too. Bet you can't wait to get it on the road and mapped up.
Too right mate. Not had much time the last few weeks to work on her
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When you say Green tops are you talking about something different to standard G60 greens? I've just uprated the injectors for my G60 (8v) and found this link very helpful."Injectors are red tops at the moment but going for green tops as they are at over 70% duty cycle at 4500 rpm WOT"
http://www.polog40.co.uk/article_injector_table.php
In the end I went for these orange tops in the end:
0280 150 785 - 315cc/min and 14.5 ohms
You should be kicking out some serious power once its all mapped properly.
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I''ve got 315cc red injectors so was looking for 440cc,
PN 0280150558 in the table I think (which have green tops) I made a separate post for info on this a couple of days ago - need to be sure of the injector body size before ordering any. Will also have a nice fully working set of 315cc injectors for sale soon once changed!
Where did you buy yours from?
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Sticker Pig
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I just bought some reconditioned ones from ebay.tidymike said
Thanks for the link - hadn't seen that table, and didn't realise there were quite so many different types, and that the colour doesn't necessarily denote the fuel delivery!
I''ve got 315cc red injectors so was looking for 440cc,
PN 0280150558 in the table I think (which have green tops) I made a separate post for info on this a couple of days ago - need to be sure of the injector body size before ordering any. Will also have a nice fully working set of 315cc injectors for sale soon once changed!
Where did you buy yours from?
You might not need to go that extreme because those ratings are at 3 bar, so if you run a higher fuel pressure the injector rating changes. I'm pretty sure red tops are good for well over 250 bhp.
Dubforce is a handy forum for G60 info and there's quite a few guys that get on there with 16v G60s
http://www.dubforce.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=23988
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MR_LONG said
I'm pretty sure red tops are good for well over 250 bhp.
yeah they are, but the 200 is at the wheels….
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