Update - I've looked at a MK1 Rivage - Advice wanted

Hello all,

I'm looking at a MK1 Rivage later today: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VW-GOLF-MK1-GTI-RIVAGE-1992-IN-RARE-GREEN-COLOUR-64K-RECENT-RESTORATION-LOOK-/131464001706?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1e9bdd78aa

I have my reservations/concerns about the car, but before I ramble on and influence the chain of thought I'd rather get your opinion on it…

Any thoughts welcome

I think this one is worth a look, if the description hadn't been so honest about stone record and sara plate being missing then I guess you wouldn't have any alarm bells ringing.  It's 22 yrs old been used and owned since the stolen episode and there will be a lot of cars this age hiding something by now. The VIN Plate if you can get a clear enough look at it needs to be untouched. Not sure if the history has any impact on getting it insured though?

From the few pictures it looks really good, not abused apart from rear disc conversion and if done properly I can't see an issue.  The seats seem to suit quite well, but I would want to make sure the rears are in same material else they will need recovering or the other cloth ones putting back in.  

RichardHall said

I think this one is worth a look, if the description hadn't been so honest about stone record and sara plate being missing then I guess you wouldn't have any alarm bells ringing.  It's 22 yrs old been used and owned since the stolen episode and there will be a lot of cars this age hiding something by now. The VIN Plate if you can get a clear enough look at it needs to be untouched. Not sure if the history has any impact on getting it insured though?

From the few pictures it looks really good, not abused apart from rear disc conversion and if done properly I can't see an issue.  The seats seem to suit quite well, but I would want to make sure the rears are in same material else they will need recovering or the other cloth ones putting back in.

Thanks for your reply. I've HPI'd (Proper HPI - none of this text rubbish) and the car is clean, fully clean. If there was an issue they would have come to light and I'm sure the car would have been broken or scrapped by now.

This missing vin plate is a concern, but feasible I suppose. It has an untouched VIN on the bulkhead apparently and the original sticker in the boot. Do you know if I can get a replacement VIN plate? - Edit , the VIN was found in a box of spares which came with the car.

Insurance is not affected, the car is not a write off.

The interior is a original late spec (93 only) cloth with the addition of Corrado seats with the exact same material. 

Worth a look if it's not to far away from you! 

worth a look definately, theres a few on ebay now since i bought mine,

Thanks guys. I went to look at the car and, well; it looks honest and I was VERY, VERY surprised - It's gorgeous.

Bodywork - The sills and underside are immaculate, body work is 95% perfect, the respray is a good one. The odd mark here and and there with the only things to mention are a bit of a defect on the n/s rear quarter, i'd say from a filled in dent (car park style from the size of it). Also a chip on the top of the bumper where he dropped a tool on it and left a small impression on the front bumper. It has the odd bit of overspray on trims, but nothing to worry about at all. All of these aren't a real concern as the rest of the car is very presentable. Wheels are mint and tyres are nearly new but all cheap makes and mixed. Roof is new and very clean, black mohair with a glass window and the rear seal/frame looks new. The N/S quaterlight window is non genuine.

Trim - All the seals ans trims look original, a few are a tad marked/cracked or need replacing in places but overall very good for 23 years old. Nothing missing from the outside as far as I can tell.

Mechanics - And here is the kicker, absolutely no service history at all - However, the underside is clean, brakes look good and the engine is very clean, it's obviously had a recent overhaul and service: belts and headgasket all look brand new - however with no proof i'd want to do the cambelt as a matter of course. Engine sounds sweet, a bit of a tappety on start up, but otherwise good for the original engine - which the code matches the V5. If I was buying on condition along I would snap his hand off

Interior - All electrics work. It has a removable rear view mirror. Seats are clean and matching, non heated Corrado fronts. No severe wear, just honest 20 year old seats. I would want leather but to be fair if I was going to re-trim I'd likely so something else in my own style anyway.

Concerns:
Front grill - The grill sits on a slant so the bottom of the grill sticks out, it's uniform all the way accross and on both corners, see picture. Is this normal? - Edit - It's perfectly normal


Interior roof lining, I'm unsure what it should look like, but the edges of the lining were just hanging if that makes sense, I stole this picture off google and it looked like this, you can see where the cream is separate to the outer roof. - Edit, it;'s not the best but no way the worse and is usual for these cars.



Overall
It is a nice car and does look honest, the kick is the lack of any history. I mean all he has is the recent MOT and the V5. The MOT checker doesn't go back far enough to verify the mileage. I plan on keeping the car for some time so I will start my own history, but without any proof; the low mileage on the clocks can't be proved so are pretty worthless - However on condition alone, the mileage looks to be genuine, if not the car has been very, very well looked after - So is it actually an issue at the end of the day?

Thoughts?

Grill should not stick out like that but it's naybe just fitted wrongly ?

Seems fair enough with a bit tlc.

History is a 50/50 thing as some people don't care about it but I do, it doesn't have to be full service history but I like something traceable when it comes to mileage.

Massbad69 said

Grill should not stick out like that but it's naybe just fitted wrongly ?

Seems fair enough with a bit tlc.

History is a 50/50 thing as some people don't care about it but I do, it doesn't have to be full service history but I like something traceable when it comes to mileage.

I had a quick poke about with the grill and it's solid. The rear of the slam panel looks in very good nick and I don't believe there is any crash damage etc. Fingers crossed it's just been fitted wrongly.  If that's possible?

I agree, I want to know the mileage is accurate, I normally buy on condition and not mileage to be honest, but my concern is resale in years to come.

Is the headlining normal?

I'm sure the grill is an easy fix, off and back in correctly.

Rear headlining I'm sure is fine, I've sold my cabby do can't check but I'm sure it's correct.

I personally think its strong money but only you have seen it and know what it's worth to you.

Sorry for being frank but

It's Cat c or d
No history to back up mileage
Wrong interior
Small paint issues
Tyres need replacing ?

£4k is still strong money and only you will know if your happy with that value ?

It's always very difficult putting values on cars from pics and descriptions but if I'm honest I wouldn't buy it but it's not me 👍😉

If you like it buy it 😊

Massbad69 said

I personally think its strong money but only you have seen it and know what it's worth to you.

Sorry for being frank but

It's Cat c or d
No history to back up mileage
Wrong interior
Small paint issues
Tyres need replacing ?

£4k is still strong money and only you will know if your happy with that value ?

It's always very difficult putting values on cars from pics and descriptions but if I'm honest I wouldn't buy it but it's not me 👍😉

If you like it buy it 😊

I appreciate your honesty and these were all my initial thoughts before I went to view. It's a tough one, similar cars are going for up to £8,500+ with sterling history. This is a compromise and it was always going to be at the price it is. But I fully get what you are saying and it's one of my concerns and why i didn't buy it on the spot.

However, the car isn't a write off, it's HPI clear, the VIN/Reg match, aren't on any marker what so ever and is coming up as a Rivage.

The interior doesn't bother me, he has a proper leather one and all the trimmings as a negotiation point. The cloth was just personal preference for him apparently. Plus it is a genuine Rivage interior from a late spec car, so actually the rarest Rivage interior. Realistically I'll probably fit some Corrado Recaro's in the future and re-trim (always fancied a nice Harris tweed for example!)

Paint issues are small and I can live with them. I've seen some rotters recently and this is the cleanest I've seen to date. Finding a perfect car isn't going to happen with my budget and to be fair even the more expensive cars need work in one way or another.

Tyres are replaceable and another negotiation point. They are all brand new and mint, just a cheap brand. I'll be searching for some BBS RM's in due course anyway so isn't a sticking point for me.

I'm not sure who I'm trying to convince here though, me or you. but what I can say, I'm almost there.  I'd like to pay £4k but I very much doubt the seller will go that low. The seller is adamant regarding the faults/history it's clear the car is still very good, and he's right! I can only ask I suppose!  

the chassis id plate is missing on the front panel do they have it?

   oh just read it again Lol

volkswarren said

the chassis id plate is missing on the front panel do they have it?

volkswarren said

  oh just read it again Lol

Went missing in the respray apparently. But he VIN on the bulkhead is present and un-tampered as is the sticker in the boot.

At first I was concerned, but it's just a replaceable plate at the end of the day.

Edit: It was found in a box of spares next to the Leather interior he's prepared to throw in! 

Your heart will decide anyway as you can listen to advice all day and get nowhere.

I buy a car when I want it 👍 and nothing stops me once I decided. I have made a few costly errors but you just get on with it and fix the issues.

It looks good in the pics so if your happy go for it 😊

£3750 is a good price ☺️😜

Massbad69 said

Your heart will decide anyway as you can listen to advice all day and get nowhere.

I buy a car when I want it 👍 and nothing stops me once I decided. I have made a few costly errors but you just get on with it and fix the issues.

It looks good in the pics so if your happy go for it 😊

£3750 is a good price ☺️😜

My heart says go for it, my head is being cautious - I've been bit before.

I'll have a chat with him and make him a cheeky offer. Worse he can say is **** off!    

id go for a cheeky offer!

Car looks good and genuine, but there will be stuff you have missed, i know i did when i bought mine.

Now that i have it i have started to put right stuff, but keep in mind all the mk1 bits seem to be comanding strong mone and it soon adds up.

good luck with whatever you decide

That type of grill is supposed to be like that; had mine 16 years and it's had a couple of new grills; you can just see it on this pic:

Alps said

id go for a cheeky offer!

Car looks good and genuine, but there will be stuff you have missed, i know i did when i bought mine.

Now that i have it i have started to put right stuff, but keep in mind all the mk1 bits seem to be comanding strong mone and it soon adds up.

good luck with whatever you decide

Don't I just know it. I've had many older VW's (but this'll be my first proper MK1). Luckily places like VW Heritage have started to help with the source for wanted parts. I had a Corrado VR6 not too long ago and parts for that were pricey and rare so i'm used to scouring the net for that elusive part. 

KevMk1Tdi said

That type of grill is supposed to be like that; had mine 16 years and it's had a couple of new grills; you can just see it on this pic:

Brilliant news! Thanks.

On the other concern, is the headlining meant to look like that?